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Droit de visite et d'hébergement du père classique

English translation: usual day and overnight visiting rights

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:Droit de visite et d\'hébergement du père classique
English translation:usual day and overnight visiting rights
Entered by: albertdeng

09:22 Jun 5, 2014
French to English translations [PRO]
Social Sciences - Law (general)
French term or phrase: Droit de visite et d'hébergement du père classique
Part of a French court judgement on divorce:

Autorité parentale conjointe
Résidence des enfants chez la mère
Droit de visite et d'hébergement du pére classique
300 euros par mois et par enfant de contribution d'entretien
albertdeng
New Zealand
Local time: 21:37
usual day and overnight visiting rights
Explanation:
I'm assuming here that "classique" refers to "droit" and not to "père"!

As indicated elsewhere, I'd avoid the use of the term "conventional" for possibility of obvious faux-ami or near faux-ami readings. "Classique" is difficult. Indeeed, in my experience, eprsonal and professional, it is unusual for the "droit" to be qualified at all. I'd play it down and rather under- than overtranslate it. "Usual" comes across as quite neutral, neither adds nor takes away much in terms of meaning.

Shared reservations for "conventional"; I'd go with "usual" altho' in my personal and professional experience, a qualifier of this sort is unusual in a judgment.

Again, a simple term, but in context, not so obvious. On a consensus of posts here, then I think we simply need to state what is covers : day and overnight. There are lots of ways to express this, but simplicity, clarity, neutrality and stating the obvious are necessary in my view.

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Note added at 2 hrs (2014-06-05 12:18:26 GMT)
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"for the father"

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Note added at 3 hrs (2014-06-05 12:28:25 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

This site dhows how the terms "residence" and "contact" are used for "résidence" and "visite". That does not deal with "hébergement" of course. However, I'd suggest that the term "hébergement" is used in formal and less formal contexts and that sticking with a one-size-fits-all "accommodate" is perhaps a might rigid these days. Example : friends visiting other friends might ask them if they would "hébérger" them. In English, we'd probably use "put them up", "ask to "stay overnight". I think that the French term accommodates (ha, ha), both the formal and informal. All that just to justify a slightly less formal suggestion than the one I put forward in 2003! ;-)

http://www.dad.info/divorce-and-separation/fathers-rights-an...

PS : I do realize my source is not mega-legalesy.
Selected response from:

Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 11:37
Grading comment
Thank you all for your input.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +3usual day and overnight visiting rights
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
4father's visitation and overnight visitation rights
Josephine Cassar
1 +3Father's conventional visiting and overnight stay rights
Tony M
4The children will spend alternate weekends and half of each school holidays with the father
Tim Webb
Summary of reference entries provided
fyi
writeaway

Discussion entries: 2





  

Answers


35 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
Droit de visite et d'hébergement du pére classique
father's visitation and overnight visitation rights


Explanation:
there are many hits for these; an example is provided here:http://singleparents.about.com/od/visitation/a/parent-child-...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 36 mins (2014-06-05 09:58:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

classique would be typical

Josephine Cassar
Malta
Local time: 11:37
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in MalteseMaltese
PRO pts in category: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  writeaway: only agree with visitation rights/but I don't agree with the rest or with typical
1 hr
  -> Reference provided specifies both
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3 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 1/5Answerer confidence 1/5 peer agreement (net): +3
Droit de visite et d'hébergement du pére classique
Father's conventional visiting and overnight stay rights


Explanation:
That's what it means, certainly — but I'm not sure what the equivalent 'official' terminology is in EN.

visite means he can see the child, and hébergement means the child is allowed to stay overnight (e.g. for spending the weekend or part of the school holidays)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 heures (2014-06-05 11:53:12 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I am currently very closely involved in this, as my boyfriend is having a legal battle for the right to see his little boy.

He has a judgement granting him exactly these rights, which his ex is however contesting.

The 'visite' part specifically means he can see the child during any one day — but the child has to be home by the agreed time to sleep at its mother's home.

The 'hébergement' part, on the other hand, means that the child may stay overnight with his father; this can be over a single night, as for example at a weekend; or it can be for several nights in succession, as during the half of the school holidays period. It specifically contrasts the 'day visit' situation.

As for 'classique', I agree with Writeaway that 'conventional' may not be a suitable term to use in a legal context; certainly, I wouldn't think 'traditional' is either, but 'standard' is probably satisfactory. I would however say that 'typical' is a dangerous departure, and only translates 'classique' in certain specific cases.



Tony M
France
Local time: 11:37
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 258

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  philgoddard: Presumably it should be droit classique de.
1 hr
  -> Thanks, Phil! I've very often seen 'droit de X classique', so don't really know...
agree  Laura Nagle (X)
1 hr
  -> Thanks, Laura!
neutral  writeaway: I don't see how hébergement becomes overnight stays and I'm not sure that conventional is the most suitable translation for typique in a legal context. I do note that you posted a very modest 1 as confidence level, which is why I am only giving a neutral
2 hrs
  -> Thanks, I was only seeking to give the general meaning, not the legal term. Please see added note above.
agree  Dr. Mara Huber
3 hrs
  -> Thanks, Mara!
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +3
Droit de visite et d'hébergement du pére classique
usual day and overnight visiting rights


Explanation:
I'm assuming here that "classique" refers to "droit" and not to "père"!

As indicated elsewhere, I'd avoid the use of the term "conventional" for possibility of obvious faux-ami or near faux-ami readings. "Classique" is difficult. Indeeed, in my experience, eprsonal and professional, it is unusual for the "droit" to be qualified at all. I'd play it down and rather under- than overtranslate it. "Usual" comes across as quite neutral, neither adds nor takes away much in terms of meaning.

Shared reservations for "conventional"; I'd go with "usual" altho' in my personal and professional experience, a qualifier of this sort is unusual in a judgment.

Again, a simple term, but in context, not so obvious. On a consensus of posts here, then I think we simply need to state what is covers : day and overnight. There are lots of ways to express this, but simplicity, clarity, neutrality and stating the obvious are necessary in my view.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2014-06-05 12:18:26 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

"for the father"

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2014-06-05 12:28:25 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

This site dhows how the terms "residence" and "contact" are used for "résidence" and "visite". That does not deal with "hébergement" of course. However, I'd suggest that the term "hébergement" is used in formal and less formal contexts and that sticking with a one-size-fits-all "accommodate" is perhaps a might rigid these days. Example : friends visiting other friends might ask them if they would "hébérger" them. In English, we'd probably use "put them up", "ask to "stay overnight". I think that the French term accommodates (ha, ha), both the formal and informal. All that just to justify a slightly less formal suggestion than the one I put forward in 2003! ;-)

http://www.dad.info/divorce-and-separation/fathers-rights-an...

PS : I do realize my source is not mega-legalesy.

Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 11:37
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 451
Grading comment
Thank you all for your input.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Yvonne Gallagher: I like your previous "accommodation rights" or indeed "rights to accommodate"//this is legal, so formal is good. it also makes it very clear the father can put the child up. "visiting/visitation", while far more common in English, is also quite ambiguous
5 mins
  -> ""accommodatio rights" is more formla than today's suggestion, but it probably still holds good for neutrality.
agree  writeaway: I also prefer accommodation but at least usual works in the context. your other answer was confirmed by a major legal expert who has since stopped doing Kudoz. I'd stick with his agree. of course that was Kudoz then and this is Kudoz now
26 mins
agree  Tony M: I am wary of 'accommodation' exactly because of that 'résidence' issue, and think this is a possibly better solution.
54 mins
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2 days 10 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
Droit de visite et d'hébergement du pére classique
The children will spend alternate weekends and half of each school holidays with the father


Explanation:
The "classique" droit de visite is one weekend in two and half of each school holidays.

See also the discussion above.





    Reference: http://www.juritravail.com/Article/divorce-residence-enfant/...
Tim Webb
France
Local time: 11:37
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 67
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Reference comments


2 hrs peer agreement (net): +1
Reference: fyi

Reference information:
droit d'hébergement
English translation: accommodation rights, right to accommodate
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/french_to_english/law_general/1039...

writeaway
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 617

Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
agree  Yvonne Gallagher: yes, I like Nikki's version
38 mins
  -> yes and it was confirmed by a top expert
neutral  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: Ha ha! Accommodation was based on the "classique" translation of "hébergement" of course. I've just posted another suggestion which is less formal. It's the way it is going nowadays, and not such a bad thing in this area.
49 mins
  -> I'll stick to the more formal legalese even if it's now a lost cause on Kudoz. Who doesn't do legal in this day and age? Clients don't seem to care anymore either.
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