Translation Workspace -> are we forced to pay the $14/month to GeoWorkz as LB vendors?
Thread poster: Dylan Jan Hartmann

Dylan Jan Hartmann  Identity Verified
Australia
Member (2014)
Thai to English
+ ...

MODERATOR
Jul 23

Hi Fellow LB Vendors!

After half a year of paying for the Freelancer Subscription of Translation Workspace (TWS), I accepted that I'd never use TWS xliff editor for anything other than LB jobs, so cancelled the subscription. Then, the next job I was sent from a LB PM required me to use the the TWS xliff editor, but I couldn't log in - it required me to reactivate my TWS account. The PM sent a message to GeoWorkz, who promptly reinstated my freelancer subscription. Bye bye another mo
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Hi Fellow LB Vendors!

After half a year of paying for the Freelancer Subscription of Translation Workspace (TWS), I accepted that I'd never use TWS xliff editor for anything other than LB jobs, so cancelled the subscription. Then, the next job I was sent from a LB PM required me to use the the TWS xliff editor, but I couldn't log in - it required me to reactivate my TWS account. The PM sent a message to GeoWorkz, who promptly reinstated my freelancer subscription. Bye bye another monthly $14!

What I'd like to confirm, is whether everyone working with LB is also required to pay this monthly subscription, or has something gone wrong? I've sent numerous support requests asking this question to Geoworkz but the responses either make no sense or don't answer the question.

I understand that I'm paying for a personal subscription, but I don't want it for personal use, only to use it as a LB vendor.

Any advice would be super appreciated.

(If possible, I'd like to get the months and months of unused subscription $$ back too!)

DJH
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IanDhu  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 05:43
Member (2005)
French to English


Posted via
ProZ.com Mobile


The tally shop: seek other clients Jul 23

Broaden your client base, and move away from this one. It doesn't make sense to have to pay a client in order to work for it.

Dan Lucas
missdutch
Iris Schmerda
Philippe Etienne
Erwin van Wouw
Jorge Payan
Georgi Kovachev
 

Dylan Jan Hartmann  Identity Verified
Australia
Member (2014)
Thai to English
+ ...

MODERATOR
TOPIC STARTER
This does not help in any way. Jul 23

IanDhu wrote:

Broaden your client base, and move away from this one. It doesn't make sense to have to pay a client in order to work for it.


Please kindly respond to the question in the post, or leave it be. Thanks.

"Move away from" LB? Look at the top performing global LSPs and you may reconsider this advice when you realise who LB is.

Thanks again, looking forward to hearing from anyone with experience with Translation Workspace.


 

Jean Dimitriadis  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 05:43
Member
English to French
+ ...
Support Jul 23

https://geoworkz.com/Support/SubmitAnIssue

 

Dylan Jan Hartmann  Identity Verified
Australia
Member (2014)
Thai to English
+ ...

MODERATOR
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks, but the Support Isn't Responding Jul 23



Thanks Jean,

But as I said in the first post, the support either isn't making sense in their responses or isn't responding to my question. That's why I came here to seek other LB vendors' advice.

Thanks!


 

Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 04:43
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
Makes perfect sense to refuse to pay to work Jul 23

Dylan Jan Hartmann wrote:

IanDhu wrote:

Broaden your client base, and move away from this one. It doesn't make sense to have to pay a client in order to work for it.


Please kindly respond to the question in the post, or leave it be. Thanks.

"Move away from" LB? Look at the top performing global LSPs and you may reconsider this advice when you realise who LB is.

I think it's highly likely that Ian knows who LB are, just as I do. They're a big player, sure. But there are thousands of agencies, certainly tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands. IMHO it would be far more relevant to look at the career paths of the top performing freelance translators. How many rely on LB?

But to revert to 100% on-topic, I advise you to check out the ProZ.com scam centre. One of the things we are advised never to do is pay to work! It seems to me you have the means to stop -- you already did it once. I doubt you'll ever get anything back though as you entered into the agreement of your own free will.


Philippe Etienne
Jorge Payan
Alexander Chisholm
Jean Chao
Kuochoe Nikoi-Kotei
Christine Andersen
Dan Lucas
 

Renée van Bijsterveld  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 05:43
Member (2007)
English to Dutch
+ ...
Unfortunately this is how it works Jul 23

Indeed, you have to have a (paid) subscription to use Translation Workspace: https://www.geoworkz.com/Plans

However, I once worked for an LSP who had an extra license that I could use before I had my own TW suscription. So this is something you could check out.

LB has grown to be a huge translation provider, and they can ask anything from translators. It's up to you if you want to
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Indeed, you have to have a (paid) subscription to use Translation Workspace: https://www.geoworkz.com/Plans

However, I once worked for an LSP who had an extra license that I could use before I had my own TW suscription. So this is something you could check out.

LB has grown to be a huge translation provider, and they can ask anything from translators. It's up to you if you want to accept.
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Jorge Payan
IanDhu
 

Stephanie Busch  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 05:43
Member (2010)
English to German
+ ...
Discussing LSPs and using proprietary CAT tools Jul 23

The problem when discussing a large LSP is, that a) you either will have signed an NDA in order to be able to work for them, or b) you haven’t worked for them.

In the first case, you aren’t allowed to share your knowledge about them, and in the second case, you can only speculate about them.

I confirm that the subscription is legitimate and that you do need to take it out if you want to use XLIFF Editor for LB projects.

You have to decide for yourself w
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The problem when discussing a large LSP is, that a) you either will have signed an NDA in order to be able to work for them, or b) you haven’t worked for them.

In the first case, you aren’t allowed to share your knowledge about them, and in the second case, you can only speculate about them.

I confirm that the subscription is legitimate and that you do need to take it out if you want to use XLIFF Editor for LB projects.

You have to decide for yourself whether this subscription is likely to make economic sense for you.

In case XLIFF Editor turns out to be your preferred CAT tool, you can upgrade your subscription and use it for non-LB projects too.

XLIFF Editor is also used by other LSPs (there's a directory where they can find translators who use XLIFF Editor), and if one of these approaches you with a XLIFF Editor project, it will count against their subscription rather than your own. You do need to have the basic subscription though.

[Bearbeitet am 2019-07-23 12:17 GMT]
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Dylan Jan Hartmann
 

IanDhu  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 05:43
Member (2005)
French to English


Posted via
ProZ.com Mobile


One shouldn't be overawed... Jul 25

... by a client's size.

And, in any case, it is important to diversify one's client base for the sake of avoiding economic dependence, hence vulnerability to adverse economic factors. Obviously, at the start of one's career, one may find onself doing a significant proportion of one's work with just a few clients. However, for business survival, the pattern must be made to evolve. To be exposed to a single client to the tune of 20% for any length of time should sound a warning signal
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... by a client's size.

And, in any case, it is important to diversify one's client base for the sake of avoiding economic dependence, hence vulnerability to adverse economic factors. Obviously, at the start of one's career, one may find onself doing a significant proportion of one's work with just a few clients. However, for business survival, the pattern must be made to evolve. To be exposed to a single client to the tune of 20% for any length of time should sound a warning signal.

I hope this helps.
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Jorge Payan
Sheila Wilson
 

Dylan Jan Hartmann  Identity Verified
Australia
Member (2014)
Thai to English
+ ...

MODERATOR
TOPIC STARTER
Thank you Jul 28

Stephanie Busch wrote:

I confirm that the subscription is legitimate and that you do need to take it out if you want to use XLIFF Editor for LB projects.

You have to decide for yourself whether this subscription is likely to make economic sense for you.

In case XLIFF Editor turns out to be your preferred CAT tool, you can upgrade your subscription and use it for non-LB projects too.

XLIFF Editor is also used by other LSPs (there's a directory where they can find translators who use XLIFF Editor), and if one of these approaches you with a XLIFF Editor project, it will count against their subscription rather than your own. You do need to have the basic subscription though.


Thanks for your confirmation.

The subscription is indeed worth it, but I wanted to see if it was necessary to be paying.

I managed to negotiate with the TWS support team to revert my subscription to the free LB vendor's subscription, even after being told that having unwillingly upgraded to the paid subscription, I couldn't revert. I replied questioning the ethics of this, and they asked for my PM to email them directly.

This might be a suitable pathway for others who don't use TWS for anything other than LB work.


 

Dylan Jan Hartmann  Identity Verified
Australia
Member (2014)
Thai to English
+ ...

MODERATOR
TOPIC STARTER
Relevance Jul 28

IanDhu wrote:

... by a client's size.

And, in any case, it is important to diversify one's client base for the sake of avoiding economic dependence, hence vulnerability to adverse economic factors. Obviously, at the start of one's career, one may find onself doing a significant proportion of one's work with just a few clients. However, for business survival, the pattern must be made to evolve. To be exposed to a single client to the tune of 20% for any length of time should sound a warning signal.

I hope this helps.


Thanks for your concern. I did not post in this forum looking for new clients. You've jumped to a huge assumption that I am in dire need of this one agency, which is completely flawed.

This was only a question about the CAT tool, which you offered no insight about.

Thanks for your time and concern.

DJH


Mirja Maletzki
 

Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 05:43
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
@Dylan Jul 29

Dylan Jan Hartmann wrote:
What I'd like to confirm, is whether everyone working with LB is also required to pay this monthly subscription...


I regularly get jobs that "require" TWS Xliff Editor (TWSXE) but I work for intermediary agencies (not LB directly), so perhaps they have a special type of subscription with LB that allows them to farm out jobs to freelancers who are not subscribed. Installing TWSXE can be done without a subscription, and there is no need to "log in" to use it. Well, if you want to use the client's TM, then you have to log in to the client's TM server, but the login details are always shared with me by the agencies I work for.

Ultimately, I rarely actually connect to the TM. Most of the time when I do a TWSXE job, I don't actually use it (I use e.g. OmegaT, and just open the final file in TWSXE to check if it looks okay). But I suppose that if you get jobs that absolutely require you to use the client's TM or glossary and you are unable to get your hands on it otherwise, then you'd have to use TWSXE and you have to log in. For jobs that start out as mostly untranslated, and I have to use the client's TM (and I'm given the login details), I use a little AutoIt script to extract all necessary segments from the online TM, and then proceed offline in e.g. OmegaT.

To sum up: I'm not sure if working with **LB** themselves would require a subscription. But I do do some work for agencies who in turn do work for LB, and I don't have a subscription myself.


 

Christine Andersen  Identity Verified
Denmark
Local time: 05:43
Member (2003)
Danish to English
+ ...
I go for more cooperative clients Jul 29

Dylan Jan Hartmann wrote:

IanDhu wrote:

Broaden your client base, and move away from this one. It doesn't make sense to have to pay a client in order to work for it.


Please kindly respond to the question in the post, or leave it be. Thanks.

"Move away from" LB? Look at the top performing global LSPs and you may reconsider this advice when you realise who LB is.

Thanks again, looking forward to hearing from anyone with experience with Translation Workspace.



I was expected to pay for the privilege of using GeoWorks - after spending time installing it, and more time trying to get it to work, all unpaid. I lost patience with LB before I ever earned a penny from them.
That was some years ago, but my approach to the big clients has always been the same. I look at who they are, and if they are big and inflexible, they are not for me.

I have practically always been offered more work than I could take on by clients who let me choose my CAT tool - so I strongly prefer my own CAT, having fine-tuned it and collected all my databases and TMs on it, quite a part from the simple, subconscious routines. OK, I pay for that, but then the online support is excellent when I need it. (I rarely do!)

My preferred clients are small to medium-sized agencies - ´Big enough to cope, small enough to care´ - as one of them said in its tagline.
They often pay better rates, or else they are more helpful and save me time. I hope the big companies never crowd that type of agency out. I have simply stopped working with several big names.
Two started as small, sensible agencies, and ended up as big bullies, one in the UK and one in Denmark, whom colleagues are boycotting. Others expect me to spend too much (unpaid) time on portals and ticking boxes, or they are inflexible one way or another - often with tight deadlines and work outside my scope.

I regretfully dropped one originally very nice agency that started collaborating with LB - and I could no longer just use my own CAT. They did not pay particularly well when the pound was low, so the extra hassle was the deal-breaker.

I know a lot of people work more or less happily for LB, but I hope they never succeed in crowding out the smaller agencies who really have a lot to offer both clients and translators.


Sheila Wilson
Jorge Payan
Michele Fauble
 

Dylan Jan Hartmann  Identity Verified
Australia
Member (2014)
Thai to English
+ ...

MODERATOR
TOPIC STARTER
Resolved Aug 6

Well, what can I say? Negotiation skills pay off.

After weeks of back-and-forth with the support team, I received this [redacted] response today.

Resolved : Dear xxxxx, Thank you for contacting GeoWorkz.com and Translation Workspace Support, where your success is our priority. We have processed the refund request for all the payments paid for TW subscription from Feb 2019 - July 2019. The amount will be credited into your account in next 4 to 5 business days. We hav
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Well, what can I say? Negotiation skills pay off.

After weeks of back-and-forth with the support team, I received this [redacted] response today.

Resolved : Dear xxxxx, Thank you for contacting GeoWorkz.com and Translation Workspace Support, where your success is our priority. We have processed the refund request for all the payments paid for TW subscription from Feb 2019 - July 2019. The amount will be credited into your account in next 4 to 5 business days. We have also reassigned Startup plan on the account and removed the credit card information from your account. Your Geoworkz account xxx is active.

Key points:

I made it clear that the subscription to 'freelancer' account ($14/month) was done in mistake while trying to get LTB/TWS to work.

I told them that I only use the TWS account for LB work, and for them to check my activity since subscribing to the freelancer account.

When I was told that after subscribing to freelancer account they were unable to revert my subscription to the startup account, I rejected this statement and said that it was unethical.

When told that I could only be refunded for the past month, I also rejected the 'Resolved ticket' and affirmed that I would like to be refunded for the entire mistaken subscription period.

I strongly suggest for those in the same situation that I was in, to follow the 'support ticket' route because it is now clear that we do not need to pay $14/month for TWS when only using it for LB work.
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Translation Workspace -> are we forced to pay the $14/month to GeoWorkz as LB vendors?

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