| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6] > | Quoting with browniz points will not be possible after January 1, 2010 Thread poster: Jared Tabor
|
|---|
| Could not express it better | Dec 3, 2009 |
Robert Forstag wrote:
I personally see site participation and membership as highly beneficial in a number of ways, including the following:
1. The "Internet visibility" that Claire and Henry have mentioned.
2. Unrestricted access to the Blue Board.
3. Kudoz as a resource for terms help when needed (although I never approach the monthly or weekly query limits, there are times when I need to post more than 5 terms in a single day; regardless, it is nice to know that the option is there if needed).
Each of these benefits is in one way or another directly tied to making money; I'm a little puzzled by those who would contend otherwise.
There is in my view plenty of room for improvement and I agree with what others have said here regarding the Jobs Board having become all but useless for serious translators. It is important to recognize and criticize the problems we see; I have done, and will likely continue to do, my share of this.
Yet praise should also not be withheld when appropriate.
Yes, Proz has some space for improvement, and I'm known to raise my voice when I think it is required. But I'm sure my business would look completely different without Proz.
I considered the option to be able to pay with Browniz a good one, to allow people to see how the system works without having to cough up money. But it is not my decision and being a member I really don't care.
I would love to see more useful changes, and not just cutting of a feature that I don't need and moving the menues around every now and than, but still, Proz is worth the membership fee, and if the website is considered not enough community spirited, I suggest to visit Powwows and Conferences, there you will get Community Spirit enough to cope with the weaknesses of the Website until the next event
| | | | David Russi 
United States
Local time: 06:05
English to Spanish
+ ...
| Great to hear it, Maya | Dec 3, 2009 |
Maya Gorgoshidze wrote:
This surely helped me to "make much more money" then I earned before registration at the site. And I guess I am not the only one who met clients and established new business relations via ProZ.com. This is what my original statement meant and it is definitely true for me at least.
Regards,
Maya
I am glad that you and others are able to generate income through the site, and I have no doubt that for some, maybe even most, this is true. The issue, of course, was the sweeping generalization that did not reflect other people's experience.
I do think that ProZ could continue to be profitable AND earn a lot of browniz (and maybe the respect and membership of some who choose to be non-paying members) if it took a firm stance against the worst practices in our industry, which it could, for example by setting a minimum rate for bids.
[Edited at 2009-12-03 15:36 GMT]
Edited because I inadvertently quoted an incorrect paragraph.
[Edited at 2009-12-03 15:38 GMT]
| | | | Armando Tavano
Dominican Republic
Local time: 08:05
English to Italian
I plenty agree with Robert. By the way is it foreseen here any kind of Browniz? Proz.com helped and helps me every day in my profession as a freelance translator and I won't deny it. I bought the CAT tool I am now using with a special offer of Proz.com, I trained myself with Kudoz answers and I find very often solutions in its glossaries or asking with Kudoz. I learned and I still learn in Proz.com a lot of things that regard this... See more I plenty agree with Robert. By the way is it foreseen here any kind of Browniz? Proz.com helped and helps me every day in my profession as a freelance translator and I won't deny it. I bought the CAT tool I am now using with a special offer of Proz.com, I trained myself with Kudoz answers and I find very often solutions in its glossaries or asking with Kudoz. I learned and I still learn in Proz.com a lot of things that regard this extraordinary profession. I participated also to some powwows and that was useful too. Every day I enter the site and every day I learn something new. I also made with Proz.com jobs much more money than I expended paying its fees and buying my Cat tool and its upgrades. That is for sure! And it is not right that only cheap jobs are posted. But I wonder if it is right to give to non members the possibility to access to job offers with the Browniz. What are Browniz? A Kudoz point would surely be in my opinion of more value, but a Browniz point only seldom. In any case I am proud to be a paying member and to collaborate therefore to take in life such an important site for every one of us, freelance translators, including those that are non paying members!
[Edited at 2009-12-03 18:02 GMT]
[Edited at 2009-12-03 22:59 GMT]
[Edited at 2009-12-03 23:02 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Quoting with browniz points will not be possible after January 1, 2010 | Dec 3, 2009 |
Maya Gorgoshidze wrote: David Russi wrote: Maya Gorgoshidze wrote:
Directly or indirectly, both of you surely benefit from the site, don’t you? Otherwise you would not use it.
Maya
[Edited at 2009-12-03 07:43 GMT] Yes, I do benefit from the site, and I believe the site benefits from my participation. However, this is quite different from what your original statement that "we make much more money" from using the site, something that for me is simply not true. Saludos, David Dear David, As for me, the site definitely helped me to extend my business as a freelancer. This surely helped me to "make much more money" then I earned before registration at the site. And I guess I am not the only one who met clients and established new business relations via ProZ.com. This is what my original statement meant and it is definitely true for me at least. Pablo Bouvier wrote:
Hi Maya: I believe that you do not have very clear ideas…
Dear Pablo, I do not see Browniz points of others, but I will not be surprised if I learn that I am among the “Browniz leaders” with my points today. So be sure I know how they are earned. However, I agree that this “money fallacy called Browniz” is good to use for some services or promotions at the site. Regards, Maya
Dear Maya:
yes, you are right that Browniz are good to use for some services or promotions at the site, but this does not allow to claim that they are offering services for free when they really aren't free. These services are the fruit of our work, of our time and, consequently, of our money.
Of course, I understand this is a business and not a charity organisation and they should be paied for his services, but not for our services. Unless both parts accept an exchange system.
Regards
Pablo B.
[Editado a las 2009-12-03 16:33 GMT]
| | |
|
|
|
| I would welcome changes improving the level of jobs | Dec 3, 2009 |
Stone me if you wish, but as a paying member of long years, I would welcome:
#1. any change that would drive the non-serious/cheapskate job postings away from the site and therefore raise the level of postings in general, and the reputation of ProZ
#2. any change that would drive the non-serious/cheapskate job applicants (low-bowling bidders) away from replying the job postings (good or bad), therefore contribute to the cause of #1 above
If users have to pa... See more Stone me if you wish, but as a paying member of long years, I would welcome:
#1. any change that would drive the non-serious/cheapskate job postings away from the site and therefore raise the level of postings in general, and the reputation of ProZ
#2. any change that would drive the non-serious/cheapskate job applicants (low-bowling bidders) away from replying the job postings (good or bad), therefore contribute to the cause of #1 above
If users have to pay (even if it is only $1) for a bid, it is prudent to think twice which postings to reply to. If they only reply to postings that seems to worth it, they are helping both #2 and #1. So, I think getting rid of the BrowniZ payment option for bids is a good thing in that sense.
As to whether this change would help ProZ to increase membership - I am not sure about that, at least not in direct and immediate terms, and I am not sure that this is the primary goal anyway. I think the primary goal may be to increase the VALUE of the membership, and it is not because members are able to bid without paying extra, but because of #1 and #2 above.
As to the point of allowing a "taste" before paying for the whole cake, I have two thoughts.
One: as far as I know, ProZ has a money-back policy. If you buy membership, and you are not happy, you can get a refund.
Two: ProZ.com could perhaps consider a mechanism to allow a few free bids for new users. As far as I remember, upon registration we got 300 BrowniZ, useful for 3 bids (or 6 checks on the BB).
So, I would not object to granting a few trial bids ("coupons") to new users,if the following conditions are met:
A: abuse is prevented in a reasonable manner (to prevent the same person from re-registering X number of times for a new bid allowance)
B: granting of trial coupons is contingent upon completing the profile page to a high percentage level.
B may help A, and having complete profiles would increase the reputation/professional image of the site.
Just my two cents.
Katalin ▲ Collapse
| | | | Paul Dixon
Brazil
Local time: 09:05
Portuguese to English
+ ...
| Answer to Mikhail | Dec 3, 2009 |
As mentioned, if this restriction is not lifted I shall probably be leaving ProZ for good.
Mikhail asked me "why sad and appalling", so I shall answer.
It is sad because once again ProZ discriminates against non-paying users, and according to this proposed change only those lucky enough to be able to afford membership could quote. Membership is expensive and at least in my case (I won six months free membership in a draw for participating in a Conference) brought no ret... See more As mentioned, if this restriction is not lifted I shall probably be leaving ProZ for good.
Mikhail asked me "why sad and appalling", so I shall answer.
It is sad because once again ProZ discriminates against non-paying users, and according to this proposed change only those lucky enough to be able to afford membership could quote. Membership is expensive and at least in my case (I won six months free membership in a draw for participating in a Conference) brought no return at all. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Misunderstanding? | Dec 3, 2009 |
Paul,
When you say:
according to this proposed change only those lucky enough to be able to afford membership could quote
Are you sure you are not misunderstanding something?
This is what the original announcement says:
(It will still be possible for non-members to pay $1, from their ProZ.com wallets, for the right to quote.)
| | | | | Re 'discrimination' | Dec 3, 2009 |
Paul Dixon wrote:
It is sad because once again ProZ discriminates against non-paying users.
To be frank, I find this term somewhat of a misnomer. Paying users, aka members, should by definition enjoy some benefits that non-paying users don't. If you wish to call that discrimination... that, to me, speaks more about the way you can or cannot derive benefits from the site's offerings, rather than the factual differences between the capabilities of paying and non-paying users.
I'm sorry that membership hasn't delivered the results you wanted. As many users know, there are three parts to gaining exposure success on ProZ.com - membership; a complete, effective profile; and being among KudoZ leaders in your areas of expertise. I looked at your profile and would say it's far from being complete or effective. I don't know how you stand on KudoZ points in your pairs, but already some parts of the 'recipe' are missing. Addressing them would be my first concern if I wanted to attract potential customers.
Disclaimer: My opinion is mine only and is no way influenced by ProZ.com nor an official endorsement of any of its policies.
| | |
|
|
|
Elizabeth Adams
United States
Local time: 05:05
Member (2002)
Russian to English
| RE: level of jobs brokered through ProZ | Dec 3, 2009 |
Katalin Horvath McClure wrote:
Stone me if you wish, but as a paying member of long years, I would welcome:
#1. any change that would drive the non-serious/cheapskate job postings away from the site and therefore raise the level of postings in general, and the reputation of ProZ
#2. any change that would drive the non-serious/cheapskate job applicants (low-bowling bidders) away from replying the job postings (good or bad), therefore contribute to the cause of #1 above
I've never paid much attention to the job postings and have always wondered why people get so worked up about them. I've met several good translators here and get plenty of interesting work on a regular basis directly through my profile. That alone is worth the price of membership.
But... a few months ago I bid on a job because it called my name. The poster happily agreed to my rate and we've been working together ever since.
If the new rule has the desired effects Katalin describes I will be nothing but pleased.
| | | | Ronald van der Linden (X)
Mexico
Local time: 06:05
Dutch to English
+ ...
| then please lower the minimum amount (now $25) or connect to Paypal altogether | Dec 3, 2009 |
having the browniz system was good, and as I'm not a millionair in browniz I carefully had to select what job offer to use them on...
i do not have money in my wallet, as i don't respond to all job offers, and i'd only need to purchase maybe $ 5 for 3 months... Therefore paying $25 is not appealing. Why doesn't Proz.com have a system like Skype, purchase 10USD as a minimum?
I think that Proz.com is slowly trying to benefit from it's monopoly position, as I only consider... See more having the browniz system was good, and as I'm not a millionair in browniz I carefully had to select what job offer to use them on...
i do not have money in my wallet, as i don't respond to all job offers, and i'd only need to purchase maybe $ 5 for 3 months... Therefore paying $25 is not appealing. Why doesn't Proz.com have a system like Skype, purchase 10USD as a minimum?
I think that Proz.com is slowly trying to benefit from it's monopoly position, as I only consider one other site (that I cannot mention, as the moderator asked me to "refrain from advertising" djeez!) a true competitor.
The benefit of having a paid membership is something I clearly do not see.
There are many general job sites where you do not have to pay anything to respond to job postings and with a first come, first served basis.
I'd suggest to lower the minimum purchasing amount, actually I'd suggest to lower the membership fee alltogether.
Paying members of this site complain about low prices, but they actually sustain this website, which only pushes prices down. Companies publish a job add, wait, don't really care if a member pays or not, as long as he/she offers want is requiered.
In my opinion, in the end, charging for every single thing, will be the downfall of this site, but not before having made some profit of course.
The next step? Pay for each dictionary search?
Then why not cut to the chase, and act as a priviledged website for paying members only. Kick all the non paying members out, after a trial period of 3 months.
[Bijgewerkt op 2009-12-03 23:26 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Michele Fauble
United States
Local time: 05:05
Member (2006)
Norwegian to English
+ ...
| What's not to like? | Dec 4, 2009 |
Kevin Lossner wrote:
If there is no room for large numbers of frivolous, ill-considered submissions by unserious wannabes (eager to work for 1 cent per word), then perhaps the general level for combinations like ESEN might improve to the point where serious translators can take the system seriously.
| | | | | Right, Mikhail | Dec 4, 2009 |
Mikhail Kropotov wrote: Paul Dixon wrote:
It is sad because once again ProZ discriminates against non-paying users. To be frank, I find this term somewhat of a misnomer. Paying users, aka members, should by definition enjoy some benefits that non-paying users don't.
Right. ProZ.com is designed so that paying members have the best chances of meeting new clients at every turn. If you compete with members, as a non-member, you are fighting an uphill battle. (Once you are a member, you are "in", and advantages accrue based only on merit.)
I'm sorry that membership hasn't delivered the results you wanted. As many users know, there are three parts to gaining exposure success on ProZ.com - membership; a complete, effective profile; and being among KudoZ leaders in your areas of expertise.
Exactly.
| | |
|
|
|
OlafK
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:05
English to German
+ ...
| ProZ membership benefits | Dec 5, 2009 |
Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I know the main benefits of ProZ membership are the ability to bid for (badly paid) jobs on this site first and the possibility to ask unlimited kudoz questions. Since this ("I depend on low rate jobs and have to ask lots of questions") doesn't reflect well on paying members I never considered becoming one myself.
The Blueboard is a very helpful tool (I always trust the bad ratings but not necessarily the good ones) and I can pay for it with Br... See more Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I know the main benefits of ProZ membership are the ability to bid for (badly paid) jobs on this site first and the possibility to ask unlimited kudoz questions. Since this ("I depend on low rate jobs and have to ask lots of questions") doesn't reflect well on paying members I never considered becoming one myself.
The Blueboard is a very helpful tool (I always trust the bad ratings but not necessarily the good ones) and I can pay for it with Browniz. You could restrict use of the Blueboard to paying members of course, but there are other albeit slower ways of checking on agencies. ▲ Collapse
| | | |
Olaf Knechten wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I know the main benefits of ProZ membership are the ability to bid for (badly paid) jobs on this site first and the possibility to ask unlimited kudoz questions.
Since this ("I depend on low rate jobs and have to ask lots of questions") doesn't reflect well on paying members I never considered becoming one myself.
| | | | | Featured member on home page | Dec 5, 2009 |
Olaf, please don't forget having your photo/profile link featured on the main page from time to time.
Olaf Knechten wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I know the main benefits of ProZ membership are the ability to bid for (badly paid) jobs on this site first and the possibility to ask unlimited kudoz questions. Since this ("I depend on low rate jobs and have to ask lots of questions") doesn't reflect well on paying members I never considered becoming one myself.
The Blueboard is a very helpful tool (I always trust the bad ratings but not necessarily the good ones) and I can pay for it with Browniz. You could restrict use of the Blueboard to paying members of course, but there are other albeit slower ways of checking on agencies.
| | | | | Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6] > | To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator: You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request » Quoting with browniz points will not be possible after January 1, 2010 | Anycount & Translation Office 3000 | Translation Office 3000
Translation Office 3000 is an advanced accounting tool for freelance translators and small agencies. TO3000 easily and seamlessly integrates with the business life of professional freelance translators.
More info » |
| | Trados Business Manager Lite | Create customer quotes and invoices from within Trados Studio
Trados Business Manager Lite helps to simplify and speed up some of the daily tasks, such as invoicing and reporting, associated with running your freelance translation business.
More info » |
|
| | | | X Sign in to your ProZ.com account... | | | | | |
Login to reply/comment 
