| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6] > | Obvious Kudoz questions from people claiming to be able to translate into English Thread poster: Tom in London
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Mari Noller
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:39
English to Norwegian
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| There are indeed too many simple questions, however... | Dec 10, 2008 |
What annoys me the most about the Kudoz system is the attitude some translators show towards each other. It's not "Great, thanks for your suggestion!" or "I never would have thought of that", it's more "I don't think you deserve points for this stupid suggestion" or "This is much better than what X suggested". Selecting the answer comes very much down to preference, which doesn't necessarily mean that the other suggestions were incorrect.
I've also noticed that some say "you'll get... See more What annoys me the most about the Kudoz system is the attitude some translators show towards each other. It's not "Great, thanks for your suggestion!" or "I never would have thought of that", it's more "I don't think you deserve points for this stupid suggestion" or "This is much better than what X suggested". Selecting the answer comes very much down to preference, which doesn't necessarily mean that the other suggestions were incorrect.
I've also noticed that some say "you'll get my next point, promise!" and they are then rewarded a point next time even if the answerer may use a different suggestion in their translation. Others get quite upset because a question was a "no points" question.
Kudoz is also a constant race against the clock. I swear some translators must sit and hit the Refresh button in their browser every 20 seconds just so they can provide the first answer. I do wonder how they can find the time to answer Kudoz questions all day long if they really are such professional translators with so many happy clients.
Or maybe I'm the only one who struggles to find the time to visit the site...
For me Kudoz is more fun than work. It's always great to be able to help someone find a word they are looking for (and I really couldn't care less about the points, which is why I often suggest answers in replies to other answers), but I don't regard it as evidence of competence. In most cases it proves who is the fastest googler and who can spare the most time in their work day. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Help the needy... I partially agree... | Dec 10, 2008 |
I agree to help peers in case they have difficulties with very tricky questions, but not with simple words you can easily find in the web or in any dictionary.
I've just posted a reply/comment to a French>Italian translator who has been posting simple kudoz from days on the same subject.
The reply I received was that the translation involves hundreds of pages and she/he has the right to ask questions. Moreover, there are also other collegues who told me that this translator ha... See more I agree to help peers in case they have difficulties with very tricky questions, but not with simple words you can easily find in the web or in any dictionary.
I've just posted a reply/comment to a French>Italian translator who has been posting simple kudoz from days on the same subject.
The reply I received was that the translation involves hundreds of pages and she/he has the right to ask questions. Moreover, there are also other collegues who told me that this translator has the right to ask and that it is unpolite from me to reply in such a way.
Chiara ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Don't confuse the Proz.com site "P" badge with Kudoz | Dec 10, 2008 |
Amy Duncan wrote:
It seems to me that now that we have the "Pro" status, some people will answer every single question that pops up, regardless of the subject matter, in order to get as many points as possible, believing that it makes them more eligible for Pro status (although it seems to me that this might backfire, since it makes the answerer look as though he/she has way too much time on his/her hands).
It seems that some people see a relationship between Kudoz and the site's red P badge, but it's fairly clear that Kudoz has nothing or precious little to do with the decision to bestow the P badge on applicants.
First of all, the P badge is not for 'elite translators':
How good of a translator does one have to be to be admitted into the program? Is the idea that only elite translators will be admitted?
No. The screening process seeks to establish only that an applicant meets or exceeds certain minimum professional standards in the three screening areas (translation ability, business reliability and “citizenship”). In other words, the level screened for is not “elite” but “adequate”.
http://www.proz.com/pro-tag/info/faq
And if you look at those who have the badge, you'll see many whose Kudoz participation has been limited to asking only and even many who have never participated in Kudoz at all.
Likewise the lies on the profile page regarding native language(s), qualifications, memberships etc. have not been an obstacle to getting the P and there are people with the P in a language pair that includes a bogus native language.
As long as people continue to answer such lazy questions (lazy-because 2 seconds of effort would have made posting unnecessary) and don't have the courage to make such questions non-pro (on the contrary-dead simple everyday terms are wonderful for grandstanding), then these questions will continue to pour in. From P and non-P people alike.
[Edited at 2008-12-10 11:58 GMT]
| | | | Mari Noller
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:39
English to Norwegian
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| We mustn't forget... | Dec 10, 2008 |
A question that might seem too simple for you might be tricky for others, especially if it relates to a specific topic. A translator who specialise in patents would find basic questions about patents easy when they are asked by a translator who happened to get one line in a technical text that relates to patents.
It all depends on what you mean when you say "obvious questions".
Sometimes I find that I'm working on a large project where the end client wants me to use a specifi... See more A question that might seem too simple for you might be tricky for others, especially if it relates to a specific topic. A translator who specialise in patents would find basic questions about patents easy when they are asked by a translator who happened to get one line in a technical text that relates to patents.
It all depends on what you mean when you say "obvious questions".
Sometimes I find that I'm working on a large project where the end client wants me to use a specific glossary (often full of spelling errors and incorrect translations), and I need to translate a new term whilst keeping the style of the old (incorrect) terms so inconsistency can be avoided. In this case it might be useful to get a second opinion. ▲ Collapse
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Simona BONELLI
France
Local time: 08:39
Member (2008)
French to Italian
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| Tom is (partially) right | Dec 10, 2008 |
Hi Tom in London,
when you say that you've had "a number of complaints from agencies who tell me how difficult it is to find genuine English mother-tongue, genuinely competent, Italian to English translators" I must admit you are right.
I had to decline a couple of really good jobs ITA>ENG because I want to translate only into my native language. I have lived in Wales for 4 years, and I have a M.A. and a Ph.D. Nevertheless, I know that English is not my mother tongue,... See more Hi Tom in London,
when you say that you've had "a number of complaints from agencies who tell me how difficult it is to find genuine English mother-tongue, genuinely competent, Italian to English translators" I must admit you are right.
I had to decline a couple of really good jobs ITA>ENG because I want to translate only into my native language. I have lived in Wales for 4 years, and I have a M.A. and a Ph.D. Nevertheless, I know that English is not my mother tongue, and therefore it would take me ages to reach the good level I expect from myself.
But very often, Tom, it's not the translators' fault. Some providers (but very few, I can assure you) ask you to translate anything - once I've been asked to translate from French into English, just because both French and English are part of my language pairs!
You must also admit, though, that sometimes sharing a doubt, even if it looks a very simple one, helps a translator to make things clear in her/his mind, and to feel part of a community (which is something that we are doing right now)
ciao!!
Ellie in Pieve ▲ Collapse
| | | | TranslatorB (X)
English to Croatian
Hello Tom,
I share your views on this issue, as I am also a translator's agent, besides being a translator myself. The Italian into English is probably one of those language pairs that are most challenging in terms of the potential for finding a reliable and accurate translator.
I do not wanna sound harsh, and I apologize in advance, but it just seems that Italian people have MAJOR problems with acquisition of the English syntax. It may be their lack of interest in t... See more Hello Tom,
I share your views on this issue, as I am also a translator's agent, besides being a translator myself. The Italian into English is probably one of those language pairs that are most challenging in terms of the potential for finding a reliable and accurate translator.
I do not wanna sound harsh, and I apologize in advance, but it just seems that Italian people have MAJOR problems with acquisition of the English syntax. It may be their lack of interest in thorough language studies, or the incompatibility of Italian-English language structure, it may be some other thing, I am not sure..
I just know I have precisely the same experience with this pair, and I share your observations.
Conclusion : People who are able to provide quality Italian into English translations will certainly be rich, as they will not have much competition. Lucky them.
Tom, send us some Christmas gifts !
[Edited at 2008-12-10 13:32 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Obvious questions | Dec 10, 2008 |
Yes, Tom - this morning was the last straw! I'm sure you know what I mean.
I've wanted to bring this point up for some time now but was afraid of seeming petty. I'm not even going to answer such obvious questions in future - stuff the points, I have some pride still.
Unfortunately, even professional translation qualifications aren't always reliable. I know of cases of cheating on my own course but the institutions prefer to ignore it....it wasn't me btw and this isn't jus... See more Yes, Tom - this morning was the last straw! I'm sure you know what I mean.
I've wanted to bring this point up for some time now but was afraid of seeming petty. I'm not even going to answer such obvious questions in future - stuff the points, I have some pride still.
Unfortunately, even professional translation qualifications aren't always reliable. I know of cases of cheating on my own course but the institutions prefer to ignore it....it wasn't me btw and this isn't just hearsay, I witnessed it!
Break from this forum for Forum now. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:39
Member (2008)
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER
Susanna Garcia wrote:
Yes, Tom - this morning was the last straw! I'm sure you know what I mean.
yes, there's just been another one....a really obvious, common word, which however has to be applied in a specific context; but the meaning is still obvious and it is the task of the translator to make sure it is correct in that context.
I will not be answering that question. But some people have !!!
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Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:39
Member (2008)
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER
TranslatorB wrote: Italian into English is probably one of those language pairs that are most challenging in terms of the potential for finding a reliable and accurate translator.....Italian people have MAJOR problems with acquisition of the English syntax. It may be their lack of interest in thorough language studies, or the incompatibility of Italian-English language structure..... People who are able to provide quality Italian into English translations will certainly be rich, as they will not have much competition..... Tom, send us some Christmas gifts ! [Edited at 2008-12-10 13:32 GMT]
Sorry, no Christmas gifts. I'm not rich. I strongly agree with what you say, and you say it well. Alas, in Italy there are many people who tend to think that a rough approximation will do.
I've just had another of those stupid Kudoz questions: an Italian who claims to be able to translate into English, asking everyone to help with the translation of "restrizioni di legge".
Anyone who can't translate "restrizioni di legge" into English is a charlatan. No excuses can be made along the lines of "ah but it depends on the context". Such a straightforward term has a very clear meaning in ANY context.
I won't mention who the questioner is but really, they should be doing some other kind of work. Not translating.
| | | | Andrea Riffo 
Chile
Local time: 02:39
English to Spanish
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I don't have much time to wade through that thread, but is it the one where we learnt that Rule 2.1 is not really a rule but merely a suggestion, and therefore not enforceable?? (whereas the "no commenting on people's answers/question" rule is, in fact a RULE and therefore enforceable???)
I must say, I didn't see that one coming and felt cheated somehow. My utter disappointment was the last straw that made me choose NOT to renew my subscription here, no matter how many e-mails I receive.
Greetings
Andrea
[Edited at 2008-12-10 15:04 GMT]
| | | | Simona BONELLI
France
Local time: 08:39
Member (2008)
French to Italian
+ ...
Dear Tom in London,
it's not fair. You don't want to mention who the questioner is? I'm not a google-genius but it took me 30 seconds to find out. Not fair at all.
Ellie in Pieve
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:39
Member (2008)
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER | Well, I didn't mention it. | Dec 10, 2008 |
Simona Elena Bonelli wrote:
Dear Tom in London,
it's not fair. You don't want to mention who the questioner is? I'm not a google-genius but it took me 30 seconds to find out. Not fair at all.
Ellie in Pieve
I'm glad neither of us has mentioned it.
I've just had another pretty stupid question, for the correct translation of the word "impegno"in a financial context.
Anyone who is unable to handle that really should be doing some other kind of work.
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Heinrich Pesch
Finland
Local time: 09:39
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
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| Point hoarding? | Dec 10, 2008 |
Could it be that some people just put forward questions so that a friend (or their own alias) can grasp some points? That would explain why the answer is already given when the Kudoz-mail is going out. Teamwork.
The Kudoz procedure is so time absorbing that it makes no sense to put in questions just because you are too lazy to open a dictionary. Must be other reasons.
Cheers
Heinrich
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:39
Member (2008)
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER | very interesting | Dec 10, 2008 |
Heinrich Pesch wrote:
Could it be that some people just put forward questions so that a friend (or their own alias) can grasp some points? That would explain why the answer is already given when the Kudoz-mail is going out. Teamwork.
The Kudoz procedure is so time absorbing that it makes no sense to put in questions just because you are too lazy to open a dictionary. Must be other reasons.
Cheers
Heinrich
Heinrich, that is a VERY interesting hypothesis that hadn't occurred to me. Indeed, that would be a very easy way for two or more unscrupulous individuals to easily accumulate Kudoz points (and completely mess up the glossaries).
| | | | TranslatorB (X)
English to Croatian
Tom in London wrote:
Alas, in Italy there are many people who tend to think that a rough approximation will do.
This is a typical indication of charlatanism. It's a * red flag *
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