| Pages in topic: [1 2 3] > | Feeling guilty about turning away work. Thread poster: Paul Carmichael
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Just got an enquiry about a 20,000 word technical translation @ 0.05 euros p/w. I said thanks but no thanks.
Now if my father was still alive, he'd slap me about a bit and tell me that anything is better than nothing, and the truth is that at the moment I have nothing. He would have said it's better to be working and keeping your hand in, than sitting waiting for less demeaning jobs to arrive. But I'd feel just as guilty accepting such a job and helping to destroy the industry.
... See more Just got an enquiry about a 20,000 word technical translation @ 0.05 euros p/w. I said thanks but no thanks.
Now if my father was still alive, he'd slap me about a bit and tell me that anything is better than nothing, and the truth is that at the moment I have nothing. He would have said it's better to be working and keeping your hand in, than sitting waiting for less demeaning jobs to arrive. But I'd feel just as guilty accepting such a job and helping to destroy the industry.
What's the answer? Self-flagellation? Cyanide pill? ▲ Collapse
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:44
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Paul Carmichael wrote:
Just got an enquiry about a 20,000 word technical translation @ 0.05 euros p/w. I said thanks but no thanks.
Now if my father was still alive, he'd slap me about a bit and tell me that anything is better than nothing, and the truth is that at the moment I have nothing. He would have said it's better to be working and keeping your hand in, than sitting waiting for less demeaning jobs to arrive. But I'd feel just as guilty accepting such a job and helping to destroy the industry.
What's the answer? Self-flagellation? Cyanide pill?
I also turned away a big job the other day. Even though it would have been lucrative it would have required a lot of web-searching looking for correct terminology; but above all it would be been b--o--r--i--n--g !!
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there is absolutely no need to feel guilty.
Imagine another more lucrative job comes in, which you would have to turn down due to lack of time.
Besides, you are doing yourself and the whole industry a favour.
Gudrun
| | | | Diana Coada (X) 
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:44
Portuguese to English
+ ...
| Turned one down today as well. | Oct 2, 2012 |
€0.06 per word. The job would have paid me my minimum wage for today. Was it enough to survive? Yes. But was it enough to hold my head high and say I am a happy freelancer who's making a PROFIT on the job? No. So I said the same: thanks, but no thanks.
I think that the most important thing is to always keep ourselves busy studying, learning and networking. This way we don't feel guilty about ''wasting our days doing nothing'' and are able to specialize, target specific clients and... See more €0.06 per word. The job would have paid me my minimum wage for today. Was it enough to survive? Yes. But was it enough to hold my head high and say I am a happy freelancer who's making a PROFIT on the job? No. So I said the same: thanks, but no thanks.
I think that the most important thing is to always keep ourselves busy studying, learning and networking. This way we don't feel guilty about ''wasting our days doing nothing'' and are able to specialize, target specific clients and consequently work for decent rates. There are plenty of good, free courses out there that one can do online from universities like Yale, UCL, etc.
This is my strategy anyway, and so far, I think it's working ▲ Collapse
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Tatty
Local time: 09:44
Spanish to English
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I'm not surprised you feel a bit guilty. You see, it depends. For me, a 20,000 word document is a long job. But, in the past, If I'd been working a lot and felt that I couldn't face it I wouldn't accept it. But if I was feeling quite fresh I would do the document, take a few days off afterwards to recover and may even buy myself some new clothes. What's more, I don't tend to think that technical translations are too draining, personally.
It also depends on who is offering the transl... See more I'm not surprised you feel a bit guilty. You see, it depends. For me, a 20,000 word document is a long job. But, in the past, If I'd been working a lot and felt that I couldn't face it I wouldn't accept it. But if I was feeling quite fresh I would do the document, take a few days off afterwards to recover and may even buy myself some new clothes. What's more, I don't tend to think that technical translations are too draining, personally.
It also depends on who is offering the translation. If it was an agency-based in Andalusia, I would probably not be shocked by the rate offered. You clearly don't want to feel that you are being clowned on. But its all good experience that will help you with other translations in the future.
Other people may have different approaches, but I stand by my rates simply because I don't want to be swamped by offers from agencies. I use my rates as a way of controlling the flow of offers. But if I wasn't receiving enough offers at my set rate, I'd be flexible. €1000 is money, especially in Andalusia. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Invest that time! | Oct 2, 2012 |
(...) than sitting waiting for less demeaning jobs to arrive.
But that's exactly what you're *not* going to do. In the week+ you'd have been busy with this assignment, you're going to work on your profile, CV, website, go to at least one networking meeting, enroll with a dozen of carefully selected agencies from the 300+ that were recruiting last week, learn how to use a new feature of your CAT tool of choice, tidy up that specialized glossary you've been sitting on for months, catch-up with accounting tasks, and so on...
So, when a new, worthwile inquiry comes later down the road thanks to your marketing efforts this week, you'll ready and free to do a top-notch job!
| | | | | That's what the guy down the pub said. | Oct 2, 2012 |
Tatty wrote:
I'm not surprised you feel a bit guilty.
It also depends on who is offering the translation. If it was an agency-based in Andalusia, I would probably not be shocked by the rate offered.
€1000 is money, especially in Andalusia.
The agency is from the North.
Oh, I forgot to mention, the deadline was 8 days.
[Edited at 2012-10-02 13:54 GMT]
| | | | Attila Piróth
France
Local time: 09:44
Member
English to Hungarian
+ ...
| Quote based on buyer's geographical location? No, thanks. | Oct 2, 2012 |
Tatty wrote:
It also depends on who is offering the translation. If it was an agency-based in Andalusia, I would probably not be shocked by the rate offered.
Some time ago, a Swiss client of mine opened an affiliate in Brazil. A PM from the Brazilian branch contacted me with a potential job, and when I quoted my rate, she tried to play the location card.
If you sell your services at considerably disparate prices depending on the geographic location of the buyer, you encourage the inclusion of superfluous links in the supply chain. In other words, box shifters with no added value.
Indeed, €1000 is money. But a 20,000 word doc is... time. And while time is money, you should be careful with your exchange rate.
You did the right thing, Paul. Instead of a very short-term profit you went for a sustainable career,
Best
Attila
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Diana Coada (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:44
Portuguese to English
+ ...
Attila Piróth wrote:
Quote based on buyer's geographical location? No, thanks.
It makes no financial sense for us.
| | | | Sheila Wilson
Spain
Local time: 08:44
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
Attila Piróth wrote:
You did the right thing, Paul. Instead of a very short-term profit you went for a sustainable career,
Well put, Attila. Stand firm, Paul!
| | | | Adam Jarczyk
Poland
Local time: 09:44
Member (2009)
English to Polish
+ ...
| One more vote for your approach | Oct 2, 2012 |
Sheila Wilson wrote: Absolutely! Attila Piróth wrote:
You did the right thing, Paul. Instead of a very short-term profit you went for a sustainable career, Well put, Attila. Stand firm, Paul!
Another vote for your approach from my end. I am facing the same situation more often than I would like but will not agree to ridiculous rates for expert translation in specialized fields either.
Unfortunately, some clients are trying the same everywhere, but there is no gain in selling oneself and one's expertise short. You will find the right clients who value your input!
All the best,
Adam
| | | | Steven Hanley (X)
United States
Local time: 03:44
Spanish to English
+ ...
| You get what you pay for | Oct 2, 2012 |
and so will they.
Anyone who competes on price alone will ultimately go bankrupt.
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| Sorry to spoil the party | Oct 2, 2012 |
I applaude you for sticking to your convictions. Specially as an outsourcer, I value it if translators reject to work for low or very low rates. This is the only thing we can do against a potential or real deteroration of our rates.
BUT
20 k words in 8 days is possible. 1000 Euro are 1000 Euro. Turning down this job is ok if you have other projects in the pipeline, regular customers providing better paid jobs, or even if you have enough reserves to spent the time doing ... See more I applaude you for sticking to your convictions. Specially as an outsourcer, I value it if translators reject to work for low or very low rates. This is the only thing we can do against a potential or real deteroration of our rates.
BUT
20 k words in 8 days is possible. 1000 Euro are 1000 Euro. Turning down this job is ok if you have other projects in the pipeline, regular customers providing better paid jobs, or even if you have enough reserves to spent the time doing some serious marketing or you bookkeeping or you taxes. - All fine.
BUT
- what if you don't have other customer to fill the gap?
- what if you don't have the financial backup to keep you going until you receive your next payment.
- what if the standard rate paid in you language pair and asked for by most of you competitors is EUR 0.065.
It is up to you to answer these "buts" when looking into a mirror. I just hope for you that the 2nd batch of "buts" does not apply to you and that another job will materialize soon with a rate > EUR 0.10/source word. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Not that hungry - yet | Oct 2, 2012 |
Siegfried Armbruster wrote:
All fine.
(2nd)BUT
- what if you don't have the financial backup to keep you going until you receive your next payment.
- what if the standard rate paid in you language pair and asked for by most of you competitors is EUR 0.065.
It is up to you to answer these "buts" when looking into a mirror. I just hope for you that the 2nd batch of "buts" does not apply to you and that another job will materialize soon with a rate > EUR 0.10/source word.
Heh. I've not yet achieved the dizzy heights of > 0.10 euros per word.
0.065 is more than 0.05 but still less than the majority *claim* to be achieving. I have worked for that rate and continue doing so, as it seems to be the going rate for my pair. I'll never admit that though - doh!
I'm lucky enough to have a financial buffer. But I've said before, what's the point in all these expensive and time-consuming courses etc and thousands spent on software if we're to earn less than we could cleaning cars on the street?
| | | | Shai Navé
Israel
Local time: 10:44
English to Hebrew
+ ...
| Instincts are sometimes misleading | Oct 2, 2012 |
Taking the job although you consider the terms to be not quite right for you is an instinct, a survival instinct (little is better than nothing). However, some instincts, when acted upon in the business world, can be very misleading. As a business owner one should act with responsibility and know where an opportunity lies and where it is not. Little is not always better than nothing.
A translator should be chosen for their skills and suitability to a given project. The mere fact tha... See more Taking the job although you consider the terms to be not quite right for you is an instinct, a survival instinct (little is better than nothing). However, some instincts, when acted upon in the business world, can be very misleading. As a business owner one should act with responsibility and know where an opportunity lies and where it is not. Little is not always better than nothing.
A translator should be chosen for their skills and suitability to a given project. The mere fact that the agency first quoted their client and only then started to look for a translator shows that they are not professionals and that the sole criterion for choosing a translator is the acceptance of their set rate. This is a very unprofessional approach, and regardless of the rate issue, it is always a good idea not to get involved with such unprofessional agencies. That unprofessional approach is usually present throughout the entire relationships.
So this is another +1 for supporting your decision.
As others have stated, if you got some free time on your hands, it is a good opportunity to do something that will promote you. ▲ Collapse
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