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abbreviation \"T-E\"
Dec 2, 2017 16:11
6 yrs ago
16 viewers *
Spanish term

delito de guante blanco

Not for points Spanish to English Law/Patents Law (general) categoría de delitos
¿es white-collar crime o white glove crime? tengo entendido que "white-collar crime" es otro tipo de delito muy distinto al de guante blanco, pero lo he visto como "white-collar crime", entonces no estoy segura si es así.

Sale en un texto de definición y es por lo mismo que me cuestiono.
Proposed translations (English)
4 +6 non-violent crime
3 +5 white-collar crime
3 theft
References
Definition (Wikipedia)
Votes to reclassify question as PRO/non-PRO:

Non-PRO (1): Yvonne Gallagher

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Discussion

Sandro Tomasi Dec 4, 2017:
@Rebecca Great tool at your disposition. Thanks for sharing. I find it interesting that the Spanish Supreme Court opinion on delito de guante blanco is in line with Aller's definition rather than the DEJ. This eliminates the regionalism possibility.
Rebecca Jowers Dec 4, 2017:
To all: thanks for the interesting perspectives This has certainly been an interesting discussion. I think we would all agree that “delito de guante blanco” is a term that may be more often used by journalists or sociologists than by legal professionals. There certainly is no “delito de guante blanco” in the Spanish Criminal Code or related legislation. Since I have access to the “repertorio de jurisprudencia” of the Spanish courts, I checked the opinions of the Spanish Supreme Court and the expression “delito de guante blanco” only appears once, but it does seem to indicate that the expression refers to a non-violent offense: “En efecto, no estamos ante un delito de "guante blanco", en el que se sustrae un objeto de forma limpia y sin que la victima se aperciba, como puede ocurrir al hacerse con una billetera o monedero en un autobús, que se echa en falta horas después...”
Auto del Tribunal Supremo, 20/09/2000, Sala Segunda de lo Penal, Recurso 2436/1999, Ponente: Joaquín Delgado García
Jacob Z. (X) Dec 4, 2017:
I think Charles' quote from Argentina is illustrative, which seems to say that the crimes committed by a "rentista" who doesn't have to work, but who instead spends his time being a homewrecker by seducing women (i.e., the crime is adultery) are more worrisome than those of a poor gaucho who is a war deserter (assuming "vago de campaña" means that).

In other words, and assuming that the history of the term "guante blanco" does not go back further (which perhaps it does), a "delito de guante blanco" is really nothing more or less than a crime committed by someone who is (at least relatively) wealthy, i.e., by Don Juan but with a clear emphasis on the "Don" part.

The actual crime doesn't seem to matter too much -- it is a crime that is committed by a rich person and, therefore, seen as inadequately punished.

Ultimately I think this is also the definition of a white-collar crime, which is MORE about the WEALTH/STATUS of the person committing it than the nature of the actual crime or color of the gloves or collar -- those are just similar metaphors for a "gentleman"/rich guy (at least by Charles' historical reading).

So, in the end the best translation is...white-collar crime(!?)
AllegroTrans Dec 4, 2017:
well The asker hasn't helped by telling us exactly what she is translating, so do any of us need to spend further time on this?
Charles Davis Dec 4, 2017:
@Sandro I'm not sure, to be frank. I see the attraction, and I remain unhappy about translating it as "white-collar", though the two are not very far apart in meaning. As a matter of fact crimes you find referred to as "delitos de guante blanco" are fairly often white-collar crimes. But this is a "texto de definición", we are told, so I think we need to be as precise as possible, and I still don't think they're the same thing. The point about "guante blanco" being a pre-existing phrase is that in my opinion it rules out the hypothesis that "delito de guante blanco" was coined as a translation of "white-collar crime"; it's a separate thing.

But I have some misgivings about using the expression "white-glove crime". I'm really not sure it would work.
Sandro Tomasi Dec 4, 2017:
@Charles O.K., the phrase de guante blanco is historically rooted. But now that we know the disrepancies between the Aller and the DEJ meanings of delito de guante blanco, wouldn't you agree with a literal-translation approach?
Charles Davis Dec 4, 2017:
@Sandro But note that in my recent exchange with James I've cited "ladrón de guante blanco", applied to the adventures of Raffles, of uncertain date but certainly before 1939. I've also been suggesting that "guante blanco" was used as an expression in the nineteenth century to refer to upper-class types, with more or less negative conntations, and these connotations may well colour the use of "guante blanco" applied to crime. This is not only true of Spain. Note this interesting reference from the Argentine legislature in 1877:

"la Comision de Legislacion debió preocuparse de perseguir un vago muchisimo más peligroso que el vago de la campaña, señor Presidente; debio preocuparse de aquel que el derecho no clasifica como vago, pero que lo es efectivamente, del rentista de guante blanco, mucho más perjudicial á la sociedad, porque teniendo medios de vida, vá, á destruir la paz del hogar, empleando su fortuna en seducciones; y este es mucho más perjudicial y es más vago que el pobre gaucho."
https://books.google.es/books?id=RUc_AQAAMAAJ&q="de guante b...
Sandro Tomasi Dec 4, 2017:
delito de guante blanco = white-golve crime Whether the two discrepancies represent a right and wrong or a regional variation (e.g., Latin America vs. Spain), we’re not sure at this point. Therefore, we cannot entirely dismiss delito de guante blanco as a copycat of delito de cuello blanco -- especially if we’re translating a paper or article that makes a distinction between the two. As such, I think the best approach to this puzzle would be to go with a literal translation: white-glove crime.
Sandro Tomasi Dec 4, 2017:
Discrepant meanings of “delito de guante blanco” Germán Aller’s version of a delito de guante blanco is not in accordance with the Diccionario del Español Jurídico’s version.
“En el delito de guante blanco lo inmaculado es la forma de ejecución en cuanto a la precisión de la acción delictiva y va frecuentemente vinculado al profesionalismo de su ejecutor.” (Aller)
“Dicho de un delito: Que se comete sin mancharse las manos, sin concurrencia de medios violentos.” (DEJ)

In the Ecuadorian paper that Charles posted, I noticed delito de guante blanco got mentioned three times on the same page of the 110-page work. The paper mostly addressed delitos de cuello blanco, as did some of the other works linked therein which were consistent with its findings.
Charles Davis Dec 4, 2017:
(Continued) The sense seems to be stuck-up, effete types who don't soil their hands, and "guante blanco" appears to be a metonym for the upper classes.

Victorian gentlemen did wear white gloves. Here's one:
https://i.pinimg.com/236x/bd/57/b1/bd57b1e9f5d40297d7e4a136c...

And the following refers to men:
"While silk was sometimes used for full-dress gloves in the early century, by the 1840s kidskin was the preferred choice for wear with one’s evening finery. At first the favored colors were tan and yellow but white became predominant around 1815."
http://www.blacktieguide.com/Vintage/Vintage_Accessories.htm

So I think "ladrón/delito de guante blanco", like "white-collar crime", applied an existing sociological expression rather than introducing a new one.
Charles Davis Dec 4, 2017:
@James I don't think it was that way round. One of the things I did earlier on in this discussion was to look and see if I could find "de guante blanco" applied to crime in Spanish before 1939, when Sutherland coined "white-collar crime" (based, incidentally, on the existing expression "white-collar" applied to salaried workers, which had been around since 1911 according to Merriam-Webster). So I did a date-limited Google Books search. Actually there was a Spanish Raffles comic called "Sir Fantasm, el ladrón de guante blanco"; I don't know the exact date but quite early twentieth-century, I think. So that puts the date back a bit from your 1946 film.

I found nothing else related to criminals. On the other hand, there are nineteenth-century references to "de guante blanco" as a sociological term, such as the following from the Spanish Cortes in 1862:

"vamos á estudiar detenidamente qué método de enseñanza debemos escoger para proporcionar al país hombres prácticos, no ingenieros de guante blanco."

Or this from 1868:

"no queremos ingenieros agrónomos de guante blanco, sino hombres prácticos"

(Continued)
Jacob Z. (X) Dec 4, 2017:
A few historical/cultural references: Taken as a whole, references like these seem to support an origin of the "guante blanco" concept as deriving from acts of theft (regardless of how the usage has evolved):

https://www.panamericana.com.co/raffles-un-ladron-de-guante-...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._W._Hornung
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gentleman_Thief_(film)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gentleman_thief

For example, from the last link: "A gentleman thief, lady thief, or phantom thief ... is a stock character in fiction. A gentleman or lady thief usually has inherited wealth and is characterised by impeccable manners, charm, courteousness, and the avoidance of physical force or intimidation to steal."

I don't think Victorian gentlemen were known for wearing white gloves in general, although perhaps their butlers were. Therefore: the butler did it!

But seriously, I think the Spanish usage pointed out by Charles, where "guante blanco" can refer to anything done in a sophisticated, elegant manner, derives from the notion of the "ladrón de guante blanco", rather than the other way around(?)
Charles Davis Dec 4, 2017:
guante blanco I don't think the expression "delito de guante blanco" is very old; in fact I'm not even sure it predates Sutherland's expression "white-collar crime" (1939 I think). In general "guante blanco" expresses refinement. The current DLE gives "con guante blanco" as "con diplomacia y buenas maneras" and "de guante blanco" as "que actúa de modo elegante y sin emplear la violencia". Neither of these is in earlier editions, though I doubt they were coined recently. "Responder con guante blanco" means responding to agression with restraint, with connotations of not descending to the other person's level.
Jacob Z. (X) Dec 4, 2017:
Oops, please read my two entries below in the order I posted them, in other words, the one beginning with "I agree with Sandro" first, so that they will make more sense...
Jacob Z. (X) Dec 4, 2017:
I remember an earlier kudoz dizpute regarding the term "lavar la cara", where a similar "false friend" relationship seemed to exist between "washing the face" (to metaphorically make yourself look good) and "washing the hands" (of guilt) -- in other words, false friends can come not just in the form of individual words, but also entire phrases, falsely equated based on some similarity, such as in that case the washing, or in our present case, the whiteness of the clothing item.

The fact that the terms now seem to be used rather interchangeably is a more modern development. Of course, in terms of the best "on the ground" translation, who knows? That's why I started by mentioning that the terms has been "used and abused in various ways in Spanish". It's all sort of dog's breakfast now.

However, IMHO, a "delito de guante blanco" can/should be considered as a crime against property (theft/burglary/scam) committed by stealth/deception/trickery, rather than by weapon/threat/intimidation. It takes planning and skill, although I don't have any citations to back this up, partly because the waters have been so muddied by the now-existing equating of "white glove" with "white collar".
Jacob Z. (X) Dec 4, 2017:
I agree with Sandro. My impression, as I stated in my answer (sort of...) is that the relationship between "guante blanco" and "cuello blanco" is a "false friend" kind of situation, where a previously existing concept in Spanish, "delito de guante blanco", has now been associated/equated with "white-collar crime", for better or for worse.

I don't think the concept of "guante blanco" arose initially as a Spanish translation of "white-collar" -- how would it? Instead, I think "guante blanco" initially referred to the idea of crimes against property committed by stealth/deception/careful planning, rather than by violence/threat.

As is still the case with those who handle valuable objects or documents, as in museums or archives, white cotton gloves are used to prevent transferring oil from the fingers onto the objects, or in the case of a criminal, to avoid leaving fingerprints. This is where the "white glove" metaphor comes from (I suggest), not from the idea that the "hands are clean", as implied by Wikipedia, which as Sandro states, does not seem very accurate.
Charles Davis Dec 4, 2017:
A non-Wikipedia-based comparison This is from an Ecuadorian thesis, and it quotes the Uruguayan jurist and Professor of Criminal Law Germán Aller:

"Viene al caso realizar una diferenciación entre dos conceptos cuya semejanza lingüística genera confusión: el delito de “cuello blanco”, relativo al poder del que dispone el autor de la conducta delictiva; y el delito de guante blanco, aquel que el agente criminal realiza de forma impecable. “En el delito de guante blanco lo inmaculado es la forma de ejecución en cuanto a la precisión de la acción delictiva y va frecuentemente vinculado al profesionalismo de su ejecutor, mientras que el de “cuello blanco” acarrea una determinada posición de privilegio en la sociedad”."
http://www.dspace.uce.edu.ec/bitstream/25000/782/1/T-UCE-000... (p. 16).
Sandro Tomasi Dec 4, 2017:
My initial opinion is that delito de guante blanco is an older form of saying white-collar crime and that delito de cuello blanco is a more modern way of saying the same.

The Wiki had me going because it seems legitimate, but I cannot find anything else to back it up. Therefore, I am calling it fake news until further notice.
Sandro Tomasi Dec 4, 2017:
links on "guante blanco" prove nothing (except) 2. SITES THAT SPEAK OF <I>DE GUANTE BLANCO</I> AS A WHITE-COLLAR CRIME
An Argentine newspaper uses delito de guante blanco as if it were a white-collar crime.
https://www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/sociedad/3-311810-2016-10...

The site below talks about delito de guante blanco and begins by mentioning the infamous white-collar criminal, Bernie Madoff.
https://mundomundialtortosa.blogspot.com/2008/12/delito-de-g...

3. TRANSLATION SITES
The majority of the rest of the links belong to translation-related websites.
Sandro Tomasi Dec 4, 2017:
Comparison links on "guante blanco" prove nothing 1. SITES LISTING BOTH <I>DE CUELLO BLANCO</I> AND <I>DE GUANTE BLANCO</I>
The most solid source is the Diccionario del español jurídico, but I don’t think it makes a clear distinction between de cuello blanco and de guante blanco. IMO, both definitions sound like a white-collar crime.

Parroting of delito de guante blanco
I see some problems with the Wiki link, the main one, being that estafa is listed as a delito de guante blanco, but not under a delito de cuello blanco. Fraud is a typical white-collar crime! I HIGHLY question the authenticity of this article, which has no other corroboration other than sites that parrot it.
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delitos_de_guante_blanco_o_de_...

The following links all parrot or paraphrase the same basic concept:
http://queaprendemoshoy.com/delitos-de-cuello-blanco/
http://globedia.com/delitos-guante-blanco
Yvonne Gallagher Dec 3, 2017:
Interesting discussion!
Sorry, I didn't mean to vote this non-Pro but saw little or no context given and no Asker involvement, added to the fact it was a not-for-points question so it was almost a reflex action! But the discussion will prove useful for all.
I agree with others that there is no real equivalent for this in English and that "white collar" denotes a certain class of perpetrator (business and government professionals) and type of associated crime so would not include many of the "guante blanco" crimes (and criminals) which is a far broader term. So, further explanation would be required depending on the actual context. This dual university paper suggests "adaptation" but then just sticks with "white collar" so is not really helpful at all (but backs Robert) here: https://www.google.ie/search?q="white glove crime"&sa=N&rlz=... OR full ppt (no. 27) here: www.port.ac.uk/media/contacts-and.../Legal-Translation-and-...
Charles Davis Dec 3, 2017:
@Robert I haven't time to research whether those offences are referred to as "guante blanco". Some of them are not "delitos" at all, and I think most of them would not usually be referred to colloquially as "crimes" in English, even if strictly speaking they legally are. I do know that minor drug offences are referred to "de guante blanco", certainly small-scale dealing, if not possession.

More generally, in Spanish prisons inmates convicted of non-violent offences of all kinds are referred to as "de guante blanco".

There may be non-violent crimes that would not be referred to as "de guante blanco". However, I cannot think of and haven't seen a better suggestion for a translation of the term, which is what I meant by saying that it couldn't be improved upon (as far as I can see).
Robert Carter Dec 3, 2017:
@Charles. Fair enough, Charles, but what about all the other non-violent crimes? There are a whole bunch of petty crimes, such as public intoxication, disorderly conduct, trespass, vandalism (e.g., graffiti), reckless driving, possession of cannabis, vagrancy, loitering, etc., that wouldn't be considered "de guante blanco".
Charles Davis Dec 3, 2017:
@Robert On the contrary, pickpocketing or shoplifting are classic "delitos de guante blanco", and not just in Spain; I find supporting refs from e.g. Chile. "Hurto" is precisely "robo de guante blanco". The term can apply to very low-grade perpetrators, sometimes ingenious, sometimes just opportunist. The sole criterion, whatever the nature of the offence, is no violence or intimidation against the person. I don't think "non-violent" could be improved upon as a translation.
AllegroTrans Dec 3, 2017:
It's entirely context-dependent and I think the asker may well need to add explanatory text
Robert Carter Dec 3, 2017:
@Chris That's precisely my point. It doesn't appear to me to mean just any non-violent crime, e.g., pickpocketing or shoplifting.

@Charles, per Raffles. Maybe not, but perhaps orchestrating a fake theft of valuable jewelry to claim insurance would?

I don't think either of these terms is cut and dried, but I don't exactly see how "non-violent crime" covers it either.
Charles Davis Dec 3, 2017:
I will admit that "non-white-collar defendants" is ambiguous, and could mean "defendants [of any kind] accused of non-white-collar crimes [of any kind]". On the other hand, it can and often does mean what it says: non-white-collar individuals accused of crimes. However, let's leave the Cornell sentence.

The meaning of "white-collar crime" in the US has evolved since Sutherland coined the term, which he defined exclusively and explicitly by the social status of the perpetrator. There is now some ambiguity about this. The following is very enlightening on the subject:
https://books.google.es/books?id=s8xHsuM62joC&pg=PT19

On "guante blanco": I agree that the expression itself has connotations of gentlemanly elegance. However, I think we must take at face value the dictionary definition Rebecca has quoted: "sin concurrencia de medios violentos". James has suggested translating it as "theft" (though I don't think it's limited to that). If a skilled professional criminal enters your home without violence or threats of any kind and removes your valuables it's a "delito de guante blanco", but no one would call it a white-collar crime, even if the criminal was Raffles.
AllegroTrans Dec 3, 2017:
However It seems (see my ref entry) that the term delito de guante blanco straggles these two English terms.
AllegroTrans Dec 3, 2017:
White collar & non-violent are not synonyms in this context. White collar crime is defined:
White-collar crime refers to financially motivated nonviolent crime committed by business and government professionals. Within criminology, it was first defined by sociologist Edwin Sutherland in 1939 as "a crime committed by a person of respectability and high social status in the course of his occupation".

But non-violent crime is a whole different sub-set. It would include stealing cars and breaking into shops, and depending on how you define "violence", pickpocketing.
Robert Carter Dec 3, 2017:
2 of 2 Here's what I mean:

de guante blanco
Con esta expresión se valora la elegancia, cortesía, educación o buenos modales empleados en alguna acción. Se sabe que ponerse guantes blancos es símbolo de educación, respeto y cortesía. Los soldados, por ejemplo, se los colocan cuando van vestidos de gala. La locución se emplea mucho en la actualidad para calificar la buena conducta de los participantes en competiciones deportivas. <<El partido ha sido de guante blanco, apenas ha habido faltas.>> Existe también la expresión <<ladrón de guante blanco>>, para referirnos a quien roba objetos de gran valor y de forma <<elegante, >>es decir, sin dejar pistas y sin causar estropicios considerables.
http://www.esacademic.com/dic.nsf/sp_sp_dichos_refranes/617/...

So, in all, I don't think "white collar" is far enough removed from the sense of "guante blanco" not to justify it as a translation option in most cases, particularly because, as you said yourself, it is really a social term rather than any strict legal definition.
Robert Carter Dec 3, 2017:
1 of 2 It certainly is off-topic, though not too far. I thought it was interesting you made the distinction because that characterisation hadn't occurred to me, so I had to try and look at it from your angle.
It is your take on that sentence from Cornell that has me completely flummoxed. I just think you're reading the sentence wrong. It simply means those accused of "non-white collar crimes" not "non-white collar" people, which would imply some kind of class privilege or handicap that supposedly cannot exist. In other words, the same defenses are available to defendants in either type of crime, e.g., entrapment. I'm not sure why anyone would think this wouldn't be the case, but there you have it.

My view on the question asked was that "cuello blanco" isn't a subset of "guante blanco", but I see that most think it is precisely that, so I stand corrected.

However, I'm still unsure about the term "guante blanco". I had assumed that it implied a certain level of elegance or style, a kind of "aristocratic" touch. I've come across the phrase used to qualify a cutting remark or use of rhetoric.
Charles Davis Dec 2, 2017:
Well... "Also available to those accused of white-collar crimes" means that "non-white-collar defendants" don't fall into that category. Otherwise the sentence doesn't make sense or is ineptly expressed to a degree incompatible with this site.

I presume that a white-collar crime unit basically investigates alleged criminal activity in corporate and government environments. If non-white-collar perpetrators turn up in their investigations I presume they investigate them as well, but that doesn't mean that the crimes committed by those people are strictly speaking white-collar crimes. After all, "white-collar crime" is really a social rather than a legal term. I don't think it's defined as such by statute.

In any case, this is all a bit off-topic, because the question term is "guante blanco", and everything I have seen convinces me that this term doesn't correspond to "white collar", despite some overlap.

It's perhaps telling that Spanish doesn't really have a term for "white collar crime" — it's apparently had to co-opt the mind-bogglingly horrible calque "cuello blanco" — whereas I don't recall ever having heard "white glove crime" in English. We conceptualise these things differently.
Robert Carter Dec 2, 2017:
@Charles Hmmm, not sure about that. To my mind, it would be difficult to make any sweeping statements about who is and who isn't "white-collar", or indeed any granular evaluation of that kind. It seems more reasonable to suggest that the term refers to the type of crime rather than the perpetrator, but that the type of crime lends itself more to a particular profile.

I'm not sure it would be possible to work in white-collar crime law enforcement by simply profiling certain people. Surely, an agency like the FBI white-collar crime unit investigates crimes of that sort, and they wouldn't simply hand it over to another agency because the perpetrators didn't fit the profile.

Thanks for taking the time to look at my reference. As I see it, the sentence "Any defense available to non-white-collar defendants in criminal court is also available to those accused of white-collar crimes" is simply referring to, as it says, people "accused of white-collar crimes", not the fact that one defendant is white-collar and another is, say, blue-collar; that would be an oddity in most legal systems, to say the least.
Charles Davis Dec 2, 2017:
@Robert Great source. Cornell really is good.

I've speed-read the page and it looks to me as though "white-collar" still refers to corporate or government perpetrators. There are several offences in that list (e.g., credit card fraud, intellectual property theft) that could be committed by people who don't fall into those categories. When this happens, are they white-collar crimes? I think not. Note that lower down it says:

"Any defense available to non-white-collar defendants in criminal court is also available to those accused of white-collar crimes."

I take this to mean that when non-white-collar defendants are accused of acts that are white-collar crimes when white-collar defendants commit them, those acts are not white-collar crimes. To put it another way, non-white-collar defendants cannot be accused of white-collar crimes, though they can be accused of crimes that are white-collar crimes when white-collar defendants commit them.

In other words, I still sense that you are assuming "white-collar" denotes a type of crime, whereas I believe it denotes a type of perpetrator.
Robert Carter Dec 2, 2017:
@Charles Yes, you may well be right. I was assuming an "either/or" scenario in the Spanish. As I mentioned to Rebecca, it didn't appear to me, from the Wikipedia entry, that "cuello blanco" was a subset of "guante blanco", but if that's the case, then I agree with her answer.

By the way, I think "business professionals" is rather a broad term. Even tax evasion and counterfeiting/piracy are considered white-collar crimes. I don't think it's necessarily exclusive to white-collar workers any more.

The most common white-collar offenses include: antitrust violations, bankruptcy fraud, bribery, computer and internet fraud, counterfeiting, credit card fraud, economic espionage and trade secret theft, embezzlement, environmental law violations, financial institution fraud, government fraud, healthcare fraud, insider trading, insurance fraud, intellectual property theft/piracy, kickbacks, mail fraud, money laundering, securities fraud, tax evasion, phone and telemarketing fraud, and public corruption.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/white-collar_crime
Charles Davis Dec 2, 2017:
@Robert But a "delito de guante blanco" IS any non-violent crime, so I don't see why the latter is not entirely accurate as a translation of the former. Some "delitos de guante blanco" are white-collar crimes and some aren't. They are different concepts, that's all. People who are not business or government professionals can commit "white-glove" crimes, but they can't commit "white-collar" crimes.

The fallacy in your answer is that when you quote Wikipedia as saying that "Typical white-collar crimes could include fraud, bribery..." you seem to think this means that fraud, bribery, etc. are always white-collar crimes whoever commits them. This is not true and does not follow from the passage you have quoted.
Robert Carter Dec 2, 2017:
No direct translation Phil: thanks for the clarification of your point (and your personal comment). However, that's not what I suggested. I said the Wikipedia description of "white-collar crimes" included crimes that were covered in the definitions of both "delitos de cuello blanco" and "delitos de guante blanco". My suggestion is therefore an approximation that is not entirely accurate, that's all.

In my opinion, there is no direct equivalent in English to "delito de guante blanco", therefore neither of the suggestions posted is entirely accurate. "White-collar crime" may be too narrow (it wouldn't necessarily include shoplifting for example), but "non-violent crime" is also too broad (it would mean any non-violent crime, including white-collar ones). I think a workable translation for "delitos de cuello blanco y de guante blanco" together would be "white-collar and other non-violent crimes".
Charles Davis Dec 2, 2017:
@Neil They are two different metaphors. "White-collar" refers to the type of person who commits the crime, "guante blanco" refers to the type of crime committed. There's a different between sweat on your collar and blood on your hands.
neilmac Dec 2, 2017:
"Guante blanco" - is a metaphor. As is its counterpart "white-collar ".To all intents and purposes, they are equivalent. On the other hand, "non-violent" is straightforward, non-metaphorical, and accurate. If you want to split hairs and go down the non-metaphorical path, that's all very good and well, but in my opinion, something is lost in the passing. Which is why I prefer "white-collar" for this, even though it may not be 110% accurate.
philgoddard Dec 2, 2017:
Robert I would normally post a neutral rather than a disagree, because I respect you too much, but you don't seem to see the flaw in your logic.

"Guante blanco" and "colle blanco" have different meanings, but you're saying that because they're both nonviolent, they must both have the same translation. That's like saying that waiters are black and white, and so are penguins, so penguins must be waiters.
philgoddard Dec 2, 2017:
"Guante blanco" is not quite the same as "white-collar". If I understand it correctly it means nonviolent, so it would include something like shoplifting. There is a phrase "white-glove crime", though it's not well known and would need explaining.
Could you give us the context, please?
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delito_de_guante_blanco

Proposed translations

+6
22 mins
Selected

non-violent crime

Despite definitions appearing in several online sources, I'm not sure this expression corresponds to the English "white-collar crime".

Here is the definition of "delito de guante blanco" from the RAE's (Real Academia Española) Diccionario del Español Jurídico:

"Dicho de un delito: Que se comete sin mancharse las manos, sin concurrencia de medios violentos."

In view of the above, perhaps "non-violent crime" is a closer rendering than "white-collar crime."

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Note added at 1 hr (2017-12-02 18:09:52 GMT)
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To add to my initial observations, according to the same dictionary I quoted above (the RAE's Diccionario del Español Jurídico), and as Robert indicates, "delito de cuello blanco" specifically denotes crimes committed by "business and government professionals", an element that "delito de guante blanco" does not have. Compare the two definitions:

Delito de guante blanco: "Dicho de un delito: Que se comete sin mancharse las manos, sin concurrencia de medios violentos."

Delito de cuello blanco; "Delito cometido por altos representantes políticos y empresariales, distinto de los delitos de sangre, lesiones y similares. La expresión procede de una ponencia sostenida en 1939 por E.H. Sutherland."

Thus "delitos de guante blanco" are non-violent crimes, while "delitos de cuello blanco" are non-violent crimes, with the addition that they are committed by business and government professionals. So, in my view, translating "delito de guante blanco" as "white-collar crime" adds an element to the definition that's just not there.

Peer comment(s):
agree philgoddard
3 mins
Thanks, Phil
neutral Robert Carter : Hi Rebecca. I'm not sure this is any more illustrative than the term "white-collar crimes", given that they are non-violent too, unless it is a subset of non-violent crimes, which doesn't seem to be so in the case of "delitos de guante blanco".
1 hr
Hi Robert. The difference is that "delito de guante blanco" doesn't include the element of being committed by "business and government professionals" that your definition of white-collar crime includes. I'll post an additional comment.
agree Robert Forstag : It does seem that the Spanish term is more inclusive than the English “white-collar crime.” No one would consider shoplifting or similar non-violent types of theft to be “white-collar crimes,” even though these latter qualify as delitos de guante blanco.
1 hr
Thanks, Robert
agree neilmac : Fine... although I still prefer "white-collar" :)
2 hrs
Hi neilmac, I too think "white-collar" sounds "better", but unfortunately it really isn't an accurate rendering of "delito de guante blanco".
agree Charles Davis : Spot on
3 hrs
Thanks, Charles
agree lugoben
3 hrs
Thanks, lugoben
agree Yvonne Gallagher : Yes, I get your point about adding an element that isn't there with "white collar" but "non-violent" is rather (too?) broad
21 hrs
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Comment: "Selected automatically based on peer agreement."
+5
13 mins

white-collar crime

From what I can tell, the English term is broader and encompasses both Spanish terms.

Los delitos de cuello blanco son aquellos en los que el delito o crimen suelen realizarse por personas con un estatus socioeconómico alto. Los delitos de cuello blanco más comunes son: el tráfico de influencias, el fraude, el lavado de dinero, el cohecho, el vaciamiento de empresas, la quiebra fraudulenta, la malversación de fondos económicos; la delincuencia organizada.
Los delitos de guante blanco, en cambio, son aquellos delitos relacionados con el hurto, el robo, la apropiación indebida, la estafa, entre otros, realizados sin violencia o intimidación directa. Se trata de delitos patrimoniales "limpios", que no ofrecen concurso con ningún otro tipo de delito contra la persona. Un ejemplo típico es el ladrón de cuadros de un museo que roba una pieza sin que nadie se de cuenta a tiempo, habiendo el ladrón entrado, aprehendido la cosa y marchado del lugar con ella sin mayor acción que esa.
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delitos_de_guante_blanco_o_de_...

Compare the English Wikipedia entry where:
White-collar crime refers to financially motivated nonviolent crime committed by business and government professionals.[1] Within criminology, it was first defined by sociologist Edwin Sutherland in 1939 as "a crime committed by a person of respectability and high social status in the course of his occupation".

However, it then goes on to list the crimes, which include those on the list of both "guante blanco" and "cuello blanco" in the Spanish entry:
Typical white-collar crimes could include fraud, bribery, Ponzi schemes, insider trading, labor racketeering, embezzlement, cybercrime, copyright infringement, money laundering, identity theft, and forgery.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White-collar_crime
Peer comment(s):
agree VICTOR PRIETO : exacto.
1 min
Thanks, Victor.
disagree philgoddard : If the English term is broader and encompasses both terms, how can "guante blanco" be "white-collar"?
12 mins
Thanks, Phil, I've responded to this in the discussion.
agree Meridy Lippoldt
49 mins
Thanks, Meridy.
agree neilmac : IMHO, to all intents and purposes, this is an accurate translation of the term.
2 hrs
Thanks, Neil. I think it would work in certain contexts.
agree Christian [email protected] : I am with Robert (and Cornell)
8 hrs
Thanks, Christian.
agree AllegroTrans : yes, but context-dependent; asker may need to add explanatory comments depending on exactly what she is translating (which we don't know)
9 hrs
Thanks, Chris, that's my feeling too.
agree Yvonne Gallagher : with AT about adding explanation. Not entirely satisfactory to my mind without one.
21 hrs
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8 hrs

theft

It seems to me that although the term "guante blanco" gets used and abused in various ways in Spanish, it really most essentially refers to crimes involving theft (not robbery), with the victim either not present or unaware that he/she is being conned or stolen from.

The thief may be something like a break-in artist, a cat burglar, some sort of hustler/scammer, pickpocket, etc.).

The white gloves are used, originally, to avoid leaving fingerprints during the act at the scene, not to prevent one's hands from "getting dirty" (or bloody) metaphorically. By extension, the use of white gloves also reflects an effort to plan a crime carefully to avoid being caught in the act or afterwards, and although that may also be the case in white-collar crime, those crimes are generally given other, more specific names (embezzlement, Ponzi schemes, etc.).

The gloves also represent, I think, a certain slickness that goes into the approach used...remember the Pink Panther? I don't think Inspector Clouseau ever managed to solve those cases!

Just a suggestion...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theft
Peer comment(s):
neutral AllegroTrans : I think this is far too restrictive
1 hr
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Reference comments

9 hrs
Reference:

Definition (Wikipedia)

Delito de guante blanco es una expresión coloquial que hace referencia a aquellos delitos que se cometen sin mancharse las manos (de ahí la referencia al color del guante). Son delitos que se cometen sin intimidación, amenazas, uso de la fuerza o armas, métodos violentos de lograr consumar el delito como puede ser el "alunizaje", uso de máquinas o explosivos, etc.

No supone ninguna tipificación penal concreta, sino que abarca diferentes delitos y no siempre en todas sus manifestaciones. Por ejemplo, ciertos robos pueden calificarse como delitos de guante blanco si se hacen sin violencia pero con algún daño leve en las cosas (como por ejemplo el uso de ganzúas o el uso de fuerzas para violar alguna cerradura).

Sin embargo, los delitos de guante blanco comparten como características que son delitos contra el patrimonio de las personas y que suelen tener una cierta sofisticación en el método empleado para cometerlos.

Ejemplo de estos delitos de guante blanco son los hurtos, algunos robos y, típicamente, las estafas. También en ocasiones se tienen en cuenta otros delitos más específicos como la falsificación de moneda o la apropiación indebida.
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