Kauffrau

English translation: Administrative office worker

21:49 Feb 9, 2011

German to English translations [PRO]
Bus/Financial - Education / Pedagogy

German term or phrase: Kauffrau

From a Swiss 'Wohnsitzbescheinigung'

Beruf: Kauffrau

No context at all.

What is the broadest term for 'Kauffrau'.

Melanie Wittwer KudoZ activity Questions: 115 (3 open) (4 without valid answers) (1 closed without grading) Answers: 34 New Zealand
Local time: 19:33

English translation:Administrative office worker

Explanation:
I thought I'd add this general description for the job title. It gets over 60,000 hits at Google. But "Business assistant" and "Office assistant" get many more.

Selected response from:

Darrel Knutson
Germany
Local time: 09:33

Grading comment

Thanks Darrel.
Turned out to be a Bürokaufrau after all. So your term fits quite nicely. I won't make any glossary entry, as Kauffrau could also be a number of different things.
2 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

4 +4

Businesswoman

George Ernst (X)

4 +1

office clerk/manager

Lirka

merchandiser

Slindon

(retail) sales assistant

Anne-Kathrin Zopf (X)

administrator

gangels (X)

Administrative office worker

Darrel Knutson

Discussion entries: 19

Melanie Wittwer

New Zealand

ASKER

Thanks everyone for the interesting discussion

00:23 Feb 13, 2011

In the end I asked the agency to ask the client for clarifications. Turned out to be a Bürokauffrau. Thank you all for your help.

784512 (X)

Germany

04:21 Feb 12, 2011

Yes, that would be a Diplom-Kauffrau. Sales executive is probably what I would use - because although a little "übertrieben", sales clerks often do use such words to talk themselves up.

philgoddard

United States

19:21 Feb 10, 2011

Yes, Kim, you're right. And I don't think this discussion is serving any purpose because we've had it so many times before. By the way, Andrew, I like your suggestion best!

Kim Metzger

Mexico

But wouldn't

19:07 Feb 10, 2011

graduate sales executive be Dipom-Kauffrau?

784512 (X)

Germany

18:47 Feb 10, 2011

I'm too unsure to stick to any answer, but I agree with Kim and Lirka's comments on the leading answer. I translate a lot of CVs, and actually, it tends to be more along the lines of a graduate sales executive, or similar.*

*EDIT: Note, that is when there is a context, and that is what the context often points to.

Put simply, if they are a successful "businesswoman" - they will have another, more appropriate name for their profession. Businesswoman can mean entrepreneur, Kauffrau usually does not.

Kim Metzger

Mexico

David -

04:13 Feb 10, 2011

nobody's saying it's the Bible. We'd just like to know that it's been consulted before the question has been posted.

David Hollywood

03:37 Feb 10, 2011

we have to be aware that the Kudoz glossary is not the Bible and indeed a lot of the entries are posted by those (including me) who have been awarded points for the "right" answer when it may (or may not) be accurate

Lancashireman

United Kingdom

Kauffrau - no context

23:15 Feb 9, 2011

A woman who likes to shop (and then go to lunch): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ladies_who_lunch

Kim Metzger

Mexico

Kaufmann without context

22:28 Feb 9, 2011

Here's a previous example showing the various approaches.
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/german_to_english/business_commerc...

Mack Tillman (X)

@George:

22:28 Feb 9, 2011

I would say this link narrows it in a bit more to fit the hint Kim gave with his first link in the already existing glossaries: http://www.kvschweiz.ch/Jugend/Berufswahl/Berufsbilder/Kauff...

Melanie Wittwer

New Zealand

ASKER

22:21 Feb 9, 2011

Point taken.

philgoddard

United States

If you checked the glossaries,

22:20 Feb 9, 2011

You should have said "I checked the glossaries and don't feel that any of the eight entries fits my context". Otherwise it just looks like you forgot.

Melanie Wittwer

New Zealand

ASKER

22:15 Feb 9, 2011

Thanks Kim. Just what I suspected. And just to confirm, I did check the glossaries first.

Kim Metzger

Mexico

A Kaufmann/Kauffrau

22:14 Feb 9, 2011

can be anything from a clerk to a university graduate with an MBA. There is no broad term that covers all the possibilities.

philgoddard

United States

22:07 Feb 9, 2011

Someone told me recently that if you enter a question and a similar or identical one has already been posted, it tells you. I don't know if that's true.

Melanie Wittwer

New Zealand

ASKER

Well,

22:05 Feb 9, 2011

it could be in retail or in an office environment. Of course, I saw that entry, but it does not answer my question. Retail assisitant or management assistant would narrow it down to a context, which is not given.

Mack Tillman (X)

@Kim and Phil

22:05 Feb 9, 2011

I haven't posted questions yet. So I don't know whether or not every question asker is prompted to check the glossary before he goes on to enter his/her question.

philgoddard

United States

Well spotted Kim!

22:00 Feb 9, 2011

If anyone answers this, they're condoning the practice of posting questions without checking the glossary:-)

Kim Metzger

Mexico

I counted

21:52 Feb 9, 2011

eight entries in the glossary. Here's one of them. http://www.proz.com/kudoz/german_to_english/human_resources/...

Answers

10 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +4

Businesswoman

Explanation:
A Kauffrau is like a Kaufmann which is a businessman, trader or merchant. So a Kauffrau is the female version, i.e. a businesswoman.

George Ernst (X)
United States
Local time: 02:33
Native speaker of: English

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

Nicole Schnell

19 mins

neutral

Kim Metzger: Businesswoman wouldn't be an ideal translation if she's a store or office clerk.

28 mins

agree

Susanne Creak: I think this is fine as a broad term appearing on a "Wohnsitzbescheinigung"

1 hr

disagree

Lirka: with kim; I think you inflated her qualifications quite a bit :)

1 hr

agree

Johanna Timm, PhD: Given the context that we have (Switzerland / "Proof of domicile" form) "Businesswoman" is spot on cp: http://www.nebikon.ch/index.php?nav=31,41

2 hrs

agree

Dawnshih: if is about "Proof of domicile", refer her job as "business woman" will be reasonable

3 hrs

agree

Horst Huber (X): A person who is not in business for herself would probably specify her type of employment.

3 hrs

neutral

David Hollywood: I think "business woman" is a fair stab at it and covers a lot of bases so without futher context it would work IMO

5 hrs

agree

British Diana: For the purpose it is quite adequate. Anyone remember the one-word designation one once needed for passports?

9 hrs

disagree

Anne-Kathrin Zopf (X): not today, see my answer

9 hrs

disagree

784512 (X): Sorry, see discussion. With Kim and Lirka. Simply, if they are a successful "businesswoman" - they will have another, more appropriate name for their profession. Businesswoman can mean entrepreneur, Kauffrau usually does not.

20 hrs

agree

adamgajlewicz: Frau, die im Handelsregister als selbstständige Handeltreibende eingetragen ist.

23 hrs

1 hr confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

office clerk/manager

Explanation:
As far as I know, at least in Austria, Kauffrau is a relatively unchallenging position/title.

Lirka
Austria
Local time: 09:33
Works in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 68

10 hrs confidence:

(retail) sales assistant

Explanation:
"Kauffrau" gibt es meist in Zusammensetzung - Einzelhandelskauffrau oder Großhandelskauffrau usw. (m. E. eine unnötige und furchtbare weibliche Form für den -kaufmann). Es ist nicht so ein hoher Berufsabschluß, daß man dafür "business woman" oder "-manager" sagen könnte... Eine Einzelhandelskauffrau ist schlicht eine Verkäuferin in einem Einzelhandelsgeschäft, also: retail shop assistant. Wenn es allgemeiner sein soll, dann ist "sales assistant" wohl die beste Variante.

Example sentence(s):

retailer is looking for two Senior Shop Assistants
Sales assistants work across all retail areas in high street outlets, superstores and retail parks.

Reference: http://jobs.trovit.co.uk/jobs/retail-shop-assistant
Reference: http://ww2.prospects.ac.uk/p/types_of_job/retail_sales_assis...

Anne-Kathrin Zopf (X)
Germany
Local time: 09:33
Native speaker of: German
PRO pts in category: 4

18 hrs confidence:

administrator

Explanation:
In the widest context, the German Kaufmann is an administrator.
Female would be administratrix, but this is no longer used. (English is gender-neutral). In old probate texts, they will talk about "testatrix" (Vermächtnisgeberin), but today, only 'testator' is used. Same with the French née (geborene soundso) when now 'born' is the accepted form of writing.
Things the Herr Anglistikprofessor never taught.

gangels (X)
Local time: 01:33
Works in field
Native speaker of:

English,

German
PRO pts in category: 84

1 day 17 hrs confidence:

merchandiser

Explanation:
seems broad enough to me

Slindon
Germany
Local time: 09:33
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 23

1 day 22 hrs confidence:

Administrative office worker

Explanation:
I thought I'd add this general description for the job title. It gets over 60,000 hits at Google. But "Business assistant" and "Office assistant" get many more.

Reference: http://www.google.com/search?ie=utf8&oe=utf8&q=%22Administra...

Darrel Knutson
Germany
Local time: 09:33
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 6

Grading comment

Thanks Darrel.
Turned out to be a Bürokaufrau after all. So your term fits quite nicely. I won't make any glossary entry, as Kauffrau could also be a number of different things.

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