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German to English translations [PRO] Law/Patents - Law (general) / Education, specifically titles used in law
German term or phrase:Dr.
I have a problem with titles and am not quite sure how to resolve it.
The CEO of a large (German-speaking) auditing firm is Dr. X and he has his degree in law. Apparently there have been several comments (with reference to their previous annual reports and other documents in English) that in the English-speaking world, only people in the medical profession use the title Dr., not lawyers. I had never really thought about this before and looked it up, it seems that there may be some truth to that. The problem is what alternative do we have?
For quick reference I looked at Wikipedia and found this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_of_law#United_States There are so many different possibilities, I really couldn't even begin to look for an equivalent not knowing what his exact qualifications are - plus we generally try not to mess with academic titles, right?
I'm working on the firm's annual report and need to come up with a reasonable alternative or explanation in the next week.
Could a kind lawyer or somebody closely familiar with the field help me out here?
Explanation: German is a lot more punctilious about titles than English, and I would leave it out as they're not a doctor of medicine. The Guardian style guide, which makes a very good bible, says:
"[Use] at first mention for medical and scientific doctors and doctors of divinity (not, for example, a politician who happens to have a PhD in history); thereafter, just use surname except in leading articles."
For similar reasons, I always leave out the Dr in "Prof. Dr" - the professorship outranks the doctorate.
Thanks - I think I will send the firm a recommendation to clear this with Dr. X but that it should probably be left out. I will also include Heart's proposal of X, Doctor of Law, as an alternative if he still wants his degree recognized. Thanks for the great discussion, everybody! It was really quite enlightening. 4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer
Our German Bundeskanzlerin Angela Merkel has a doctorate in physics but I don't think she is ever called Dr Merkel, is she? However, this is not because she now has a "higher" title, as the alternative is often just Frau Merkel. Or do you think she doesn't want it? I would say it is safest to ask the man himself. If he is REALLY SO important he will have one or more PAs who are used to dealing with this sort of enquiry.
having worked at a university in Austria, I can say with reasonable confidence that a Dr is NOT a PhD. there are official equalences within the EU, and I don't think this is one of them.
Grundsätzlich würde ich philgoddard zustimmen. Die entscheidende Frage ist: Für wen ist der Text (= die Übersetzung) bestimmt? Für Europäer, Asiaten, Russen ? In diesem Fall würde ich den Titel hinzufügen. Für Engländer und Amerikaner etc. würde ich Dr. weglassen. Die betroffenen Personen haben sicher nichts dagegen, wenn man ihnen mitteilt, dass dies z.B. in Amerika nicht üblich ist. Schließlich wollen auch Führungskräfte nicht altmodisch wirken, sondern sich mit der "Weltsprache" Englisch im Einklang wissen.
What exactly does your client want? I would suggest asking them! Perhaps it may be appropriate to list his academic qualifications at the end of his signature block in his name:
I. M. Pretentious PhD DPhil MA (Cantab)
As appropriate and leave the Doctor bit out at the front all together. In text referring to him I have seen the use of Dr Pretentious in both English and German reports and texts.
No, I haven't made up my mind - I've been leaving Dr. in the documents and the customer has come back with this question so I'm rethinking it and not quite sure what would be proper at this point. Although it's looking more and more like it might just be better to drop it. I really appreciate the input everybody is giving me!
It sounds like you've already made up your mind, Jennifer - but I do think you should bear in mind that you're trying to make the document look as "English" as possible. Many people in English-speaking cultures regard the use of Dr before your name, or PhD after it, as somewhat pretentious unless you're a doctor of medicine. I have a degree which I worked hard for, but I don't put MA after my name. Likewise, the fact that your CEO is a doctor of law is not relevant to the company's annual report.
He's Swiss and yes, they love their titles, too. I also leave off Dr. if combined with Dr. Prof. but would never drop Dr. since, as somebody once told me, they worked so hard to get the title, they would be mad if we dropped it! I may have to enquire about his actual degree - maybe he even knows what it should be (but he's not being bothered with this discussion).
Dr is OK, but better if you add his post-nominals too. Although frowned upon in the UK it is usual to see PhD, DBA or DPhil (perhaps he has one of these) referred to as Dr in the appropriate circles. I am sure if you miss off the Dr from his name, you will hear about it from them!
Might make a difference - the Austrians really do love their titles (as Georg Mikes wrote, the title Dr. before your name merely means you come from Central Europe). I tend to keep titles as they are (and have done for the odd annual report). I would actually ask the company what they want to do.
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Answers
6 mins confidence: peer agreement (net): +3
leave it out
Explanation: German is a lot more punctilious about titles than English, and I would leave it out as they're not a doctor of medicine. The Guardian style guide, which makes a very good bible, says:
"[Use] at first mention for medical and scientific doctors and doctors of divinity (not, for example, a politician who happens to have a PhD in history); thereafter, just use surname except in leading articles."
For similar reasons, I always leave out the Dr in "Prof. Dr" - the professorship outranks the doctorate.
Example sentence(s):
http://www.guardian.co.uk/styleguide/d
philgoddard United States Specializes in field Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 198
Grading comment
Thanks - I think I will send the firm a recommendation to clear this with Dr. X but that it should probably be left out. I will also include Heart's proposal of X, Doctor of Law, as an alternative if he still wants his degree recognized. Thanks for the great discussion, everybody! It was really quite enlightening.
peer agreement (net): +3