Glossary entry (derived from question below)
English term or phrase:
cup of the vales
English answer:
Some more ideas
Added to glossary by
schwensen (X)
Aug 26, 2003 07:17
20 yrs ago
English term
schwensen (X)
cup of the vales
English
Art/Literary
Poetry & Literature
Poem-Dylan Thomas-Welsh expression?
Dear all,
The text is as follows:
It is a winter's tale
That the snow blind twilight ferries over the lakes
And floating fields from the farm in the cup of the vales,
Gliding windless through the hand folded flakes,
The pale breath of cattle at the stealthy sail,
[...]
Dylan Thomas... Who else could it be ;-)
I've already posted this question in EN>SP as I needed som ideas for a translation class. I have a Spanish translation (from "Visor") of this poem, in which "cup of the vales" has been translated as "copa del valle" and I also got a couple of good ideas from the EN-SP kudoz question.
The problem is that my student is from Wales and she thinks that it has a different meaning -that the expression is typically Welsh- but she doesn't remember in what sense... :-(
As she keeps insisting, I now ask again, hoping that someone can tell me if this expression refers to something else than just the "floor of the valleys" or a lily bloom.
Anna
The text is as follows:
It is a winter's tale
That the snow blind twilight ferries over the lakes
And floating fields from the farm in the cup of the vales,
Gliding windless through the hand folded flakes,
The pale breath of cattle at the stealthy sail,
[...]
Dylan Thomas... Who else could it be ;-)
I've already posted this question in EN>SP as I needed som ideas for a translation class. I have a Spanish translation (from "Visor") of this poem, in which "cup of the vales" has been translated as "copa del valle" and I also got a couple of good ideas from the EN-SP kudoz question.
The problem is that my student is from Wales and she thinks that it has a different meaning -that the expression is typically Welsh- but she doesn't remember in what sense... :-(
As she keeps insisting, I now ask again, hoping that someone can tell me if this expression refers to something else than just the "floor of the valleys" or a lily bloom.
Anna
Responses
+1
6 hrs
Kim Metzger
Mexico
Mexico
Native in English
&
English
Specializes in field
Mexico
Committed to Quality and Service
Native in: English (Variant: US) 
Works in: German to English
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:
277
Selected
Some more ideas
Hi Anna, I don't know how we can solve this puzzle if 'cup of the vales' is a typically Welsh expression and we don't get a visit from an expert on Welsh phrases. But here are a few ideas. One definition of cup in the OED is 'small hollow or depression in the ground.' The OED also gives these definitions of vale - valley, esp. one that's wide and flat. 2. Fig. the world in general, esp. as a place or time of suffering or trouble; the world regarded as a scene of one's earthly existence." Isaiah 24:1-12: "The world we live in is a world of disappointment, a vale of tears; the children of men in it are but of few days, and full of trouble, See the power of God's curse, how it makes all empty, and lays waste all ranks and conditions."
One of the many possible connotations of "...the farm in the cup of the vales" is the farm at the bottom of the troubled world
One of the many possible connotations of "...the farm in the cup of the vales" is the farm at the bottom of the troubled world
Reference:
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thank you for some good ideas! They helped me a lot, and if I -some day- get a Welshman's explanation I'll forward it ;o)"
1 hr
Tudor Soiman
Whenever you need quality on time
Native in: Romanian
Works in: English to Romanian, French to Romanian, Romanian to English
valleys
plain English
+1
3 hrs
airmailrpl
Brazil
Brazil
Native in English
&
English
Works in field
Brazil
Technical - Fast - good price - accurate
Native in: English (Variant: US) 
, Portuguese (Variant: Brazilian)
Works in: English to Portuguese, Portuguese to English, English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
64
bottom of the valleys..also means leave-taking or farewell, but not in this phrase
1) vale 1. The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000.
...Middle English, from Old French val, from Latin valls. See wel-2 in Appendix I....
PRONUNCIATION: vl
NOUN: A valley, often coursed by a stream; a dale.
ETYMOLOGY: Middle English, from Old French val, from Latin valls. See wel-2 in Appendix I.
2) vale 2. The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000.
vale2
SYLLABICATION: va·le
PRONUNCIATION: vl, wäl
INTERJECTION: Used to express leave-taking or farewell.
NOUN: A farewell.
ETYMOLOGY: Latin val, sing. imperative of valre, to be strong or well. See wal- in Appendix I.
...Used to express leave-taking or farewell. A farewell. Latin val, sing. imperative of valre, to be strong or well. See wal- in Appendix I....
...Middle English, from Old French val, from Latin valls. See wel-2 in Appendix I....
PRONUNCIATION: vl
NOUN: A valley, often coursed by a stream; a dale.
ETYMOLOGY: Middle English, from Old French val, from Latin valls. See wel-2 in Appendix I.
2) vale 2. The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000.
vale2
SYLLABICATION: va·le
PRONUNCIATION: vl, wäl
INTERJECTION: Used to express leave-taking or farewell.
NOUN: A farewell.
ETYMOLOGY: Latin val, sing. imperative of valre, to be strong or well. See wal- in Appendix I.
...Used to express leave-taking or farewell. A farewell. Latin val, sing. imperative of valre, to be strong or well. See wal- in Appendix I....
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