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This question was closed without grading. Reason: Answer found elsewhere
Aug 1, 2012 15:04
11 yrs ago
French term

rite d’installation

French to English Social Sciences Anthropology West Africa
" ... une autonomie foncière du groupe de lignages résidents vis à vis des groupes de lignages voisins ; une indépendance rituelle, notamment en matière d’enfouissement des morts, de rites annuels de fertilité et de fécondité, et de rites d’installation."

Unfortunately, there is nothing further about the rites d'installation, as they are only mentioned as an example of the autonomy of the various lineages.
Proposed translations (English)
3 +1 installation rite/s
3 territorial rites
3 investiture rite
3 Land or House Blessing
4 -1 (land) bestowal ceremony
2 settlement rites /rituals
References
finding
Installation

Discussion

liz askew Aug 2, 2012:
Fair enough. Lack of full context never helps the answerers though.
B D Finch (asker) Aug 2, 2012:
Re information I have already let you know as much of the context as confidentiality permits me to disclose and have also told you what my final translation is, That is more than many KudoZ Askers do. I do have a translation to get on with, so can we please just leave it at that.
Benjamin Hall Aug 2, 2012:
Re B D Finch Very often, Kudoz questions create debates as it becomes interesting to know the best translation for a given word. It can be useful for the person asking the question but also for those who help. We just want to know the best answer! Nothing to do with points... on this one anyway :)
liz askew Aug 2, 2012:
I am fed up with certain members mis-interpreting my intentions. I have enough points to start a shop up, it has nothing to do with points, goodness me!
liz askew Aug 2, 2012:
"scrabbling for points" is a total irrelevance here. As I said research is evidence-based, this is what counts for me. Kindly post the full context in French with your examples of "rite/s d'installation", then we can all understand, rather than all of us taking a stab in the dark, without full and complete context from the asker.
B D Finch (asker) Aug 2, 2012:
@Benjamin and Liz @Benjamin I am fully aware of that and this is not about a "rite of passage".

@Liz We might have a misunderstanding here: the object of asking a KudoZ question is to help the Asker, rather than to help answerers scrabbling for points. I'm glad that you are taking an interest in anthropology.
Benjamin Hall Aug 2, 2012:
Installation rite Rite d'installation can be translated as "installation rite" as Victor Turner describes it in his "The Liminality of an Installation Rite". He referes to "installation" as a ritual through which a member of a given tribe reaches a higher rank in the community through a liminal phase (in this case by wearing a bracelet previously soaked in sacrifical blood - Ndembu of Zambia). No sign yet of land appropriation... but the word could have several meanings!

English version:
http://www.unoacademia.ch/webdav/site/developpement/shared/d...

French version:
http://www.scienceshumaines.com/les-rites-de-passage_fr_1079...

Strange that I can't remember coming accross that word (after 4 years studying social anthropology in the UK).
liz askew Aug 2, 2012:
Hi,
One last comment, I have found this reference (though not in relation to West Africa)....
Untitled - Google Books Result
books.google.co.uk/books?id=DBORe3LVS5QC...
François de Medeiros
... communautaire du fokonolona les tensions d'une société différenciée. Le régime ... L'antériorité d'installation, assurant le contrôle des terres et, normalement, ...

Cheers!
liz askew Aug 2, 2012:
I have been reading all about social anthropology and have even translated one or two texts myself on the subject and know Africans from West Africa. In any case, you still have not provided the full context in French, which I did request from you earlier. This is about context and evidence.
Benjamin Hall Aug 2, 2012:
re In social anthropology, the most common way to name a ritual through which a boy becomes a man is "rite of passage".
B D Finch (asker) Aug 2, 2012:
@liz The land is effectively "owned" by the lineage. it is about transmission of land rights which impart lineage status. Though, it could also be used about accession to a leadership/chief role.
liz askew Aug 2, 2012:
Good.
Yes, this fits better.
So, to do with status/transition from boy to man/becoming a chief, rather than land ownership.
B D Finch (asker) Aug 2, 2012:
Answer found Last night, watching the video of the (fake) Queen parachuting from a helicopter, it suddenly struck me that the answer is "accession rites"! Thanks to everybody for your contributions, but I am closing the question.
B D Finch (asker) Aug 1, 2012:
Context I'll see tomorrow whether I can give more context. Going to sleep now.
liz askew Aug 1, 2012:
@B D Finch:
why won't you supply the full context in French based on your statement that this refers to land? I would be very interested to see the full French context.
liz askew Aug 1, 2012:
maybe, but "rite" is not a synonym of "right", is it? cheers!
Kate Collyer Aug 1, 2012:
@ liz A rite could establish/officialise your right, though!
liz askew Aug 1, 2012:
rite - definition of rite by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and ...
www.thefreedictionary.com/rite
The prescribed or customary form for conducting a religious or other solemn ceremony: the rite of baptism. 2. A ceremonial act or series of acts: fertility rites. 3.
liz askew Aug 1, 2012:
Could we have the full context in French, i.e. where "installation" is used in the document in reference to land occupation...

"rites" are not rights though:)
B D Finch (asker) Aug 1, 2012:
Further information I now have the further information that, later in the document, "installation" is definitely used in relation to a person obtaining or being given and exercising rights to occupy and use land.

Proposed translations

23 mins

territorial rites

I would infer that the expression refers to the process of establishing property rights wherein the land becomes recognized as belonging to a certain lineage.
Peer comment(s):
neutral Kate Collyer : Yes, but the scope for confusion with "territorial rights" is immense!
4 hrs
That's true, but the phrase does exist in an anthropological sense and I don't think it would be easily misunderstood in this context. There is a good definition of "territorial rite" here:http://books.google.ca/books?id=EfdqVtOk7rMC&pg=PA179&lpg=PA...
Something went wrong...
58 mins

investiture rite

I think we are taliing about hierarchy here.

I thought of "enthronement" but that's more for kings etc...

"Investiture" is for someone who gets granted power.
Reference:

http://www.wordreference.com/fren/investiture

Peer comment(s):
neutral Kate Collyer : The Asker clarified this is about land, not power.
3 hrs
Something went wrong...
17 mins

settlement rites /rituals

This sounded fine to me but I have to admit that a Google search doesn't confirm my hunches so I've given it a low confidence level

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2012-08-01 18:49:18 GMT)
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Hello Liz and All

I just can't go with 'installation rites' as you don't install yourself on land
The Google hits for this phrase are for people being inaugurated into a post and not onto land.

I am going to make a second suggestion in 'answers'

Peer comment(s):
neutral liz askew : sure, but we need to have the full context in French with the references about land. I have found nothing in relation to land with this phrase in French.
6 hrs
Something went wrong...
3 hrs

Land or House Blessing

Hello (again)

I just can't go with 'installation rites' so here is a second suggestion that fits the context and gets more relevant Google hits than my first answer
Reference:

http://www.joslin.cc/land_blessing.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_blessing

Note from asker:
Afraid not. That would not be acceptable in this anthropological context as it is not culturally neutral. I am looking for specialist terminology.
Something went wrong...
+1
21 mins

installation rite/s

http://digitalcommons.library.umaine.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi...

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Note added at 22 mins (2012-08-01 15:26:34 GMT)
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page 15

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Note added at 23 mins (2012-08-01 15:28:31 GMT)
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Schizophrenia- rethinking the boundaries
www.britsoc.co.uk/user_doc/SG_Mental_Tpagepaper.doc
File Format: Microsoft Word - Quick View
As an example of a rite of passage he described the installation rite of the senior chief of the Ndembu of Zambia. The liminal is the middle, indeterminate, ...

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Note added at 29 mins (2012-08-01 15:34:09 GMT)
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Rites of passage Facts, information, pictures | Encyclopedia.com ...
www.encyclopedia.com › ... › Anatomy and Physiology
Rituals are for Turner always associated with rites of passage that mark a ...... and cultural salience given rather to marriage, to the installation of office holders, ...

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Note added at 1 hr (2012-08-01 16:45:10 GMT)
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https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:LbUlIRCUwEIJ:ias....

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Note added at 1 hr (2012-08-01 16:45:40 GMT)
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see

installation

here

re chiefs


this is all I can find for this

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Note added at 6 hrs (2012-08-01 21:45:32 GMT)
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hi
found this

Un candomblé en Belgique : Traces ethnographiques d'une tentative
cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt... - Translate this page
by A HALLOY - 2001 - Cited by 1 - Related articles
Un candomblé en Belgique : Traces ethnographiques d'une tentative d'installation et ses difficultés = A candomblé in Belgium: Ethnographic tracks of a setting ...

though not with "rites"..

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 hrs (2012-08-01 21:55:00 GMT)
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http://www.scienceshumaines.com/les-rites-de-passage_fr_1079...


Victor Turner, élève de Gluckman et lui aussi spécialiste de l'Afrique, poussera plus loin cette analyse. En 1969, il publie une série de conférences qui s'appuient sur sa connaissance détaillée des rites des Ndembu du Congo pour reprendre la question des rites de passage. Il s'intéresse, en particulier, à leur phase centrale qualifiée de liminaire par van Gennep. Il remarque que dans certains rites de procréation, d'installation et d'initiation, cette phase centrale est marquée par l'humiliation des bénéficiaires du rite. Ainsi, chez les Ndembu, le futur chef suprême devait accepter d'être dénudé, copieusement insulté, menacé et maltraité par ses sujets, avant de devenir leur souverain.


so,
I have only found "rites d'installation" in texts relating to V W Turner
Peer comment(s):
agree Gurudutt Kamath : Yes, this seems to be correct.
1 hr
Thank you! At least I was right on track...
Something went wrong...
-1
4 hrs

(land) bestowal ceremony

I think it is beneficial to avoid any possible confusion with both 'installation' and 'rite'.

Avoiding a repetition of 'rite' feels better stylistically too.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 7 hrs (2012-08-01 22:26:21 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Used in Aboriginal Australian contexts:

http://www.lyrichord.com/linernotes/LYRCD7442US.pdf

(p6 "Bundurr")
Note from asker:
Thanks Kate, but no. "Rite" is an essential term!
Peer comment(s):
neutral liz askew : You have not provided any anthropological evidence relating to West Africa for this answer
2 hrs
No - despite the lack of google hits, I am going by what the Asker states the later gloss says!
disagree Natalie Pavey (X) : Even though eliminating the repetition of the word "rite" sounds good, the style should normally stay the same in the translation and furthermore, the meaning of 'rite' does not change from one language to the other.
23 hrs
Something went wrong...

Reference comments

19 mins
Reference:

finding

seems to refer to chiefs

322Lecture 9-Liminality 2004
www.wlu.ca/documents/18514/322Lecture1-Liminality2006.doc
File Format: Microsoft Word - Quick View
A typical rite of passage is the installation rite that Turner discusses in the chapter “Liminality and Communitas”, from the book The Ritual Process. This rite took ...
Note from asker:
That's what I thought originally, however, I now think reference to chiefs is at best marginal and it is really about land rights being passed on within lineages (and the accompanying rites).
Of course, there is an inseparable link between the passing on of landholding rights and the passing on of status.
Something went wrong...
1 hr
Reference:

Installation

Usual references found are as installation of chiefs (second link). However, there could be other installations also (see first link).
Reference:

http://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=12&ved=0CFoQFjABOAo&url=http%3A%2F%2Fsemgai.free.fr%2Fdoc_et_pdf%2Fafrica_A4.

http://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=13&ved=0CFwQFjACOAo&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.unoacademia.ch%2Fwebdav%2Fsite%2Fdev

Something went wrong...
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