| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | "Translationism"- are you a victim? Thread poster: Audrey Pate
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Oliver Walter 
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:15
German to English
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| The difference | Aug 31, 2011 |
Jeff Whittaker wrote:
The biggest issue I face is that people assume that I know the meaning of every word or term and they are surprised that I have to look things up or research terminology. Often times companies will call me up and ask for the translation of a word or phrase and are surprised when sometimes I can't do that immediately over the phone.
I might even say that the main difference between a translator and somebody who knows another language is that the translator knows how to research teminology.
Oliver
[Edited at 2011-08-31 21:15 GMT]
| | | | Stephen Gobin
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:15
German to English
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| Missed opportunity for a pithy retort | Aug 31, 2011 |
Audrey, you could have retorted along the lines that your friend certainly cannot be compared to someone who works in a bank. After all, not even the world's worst translator would have been so successful in causing such wreckage to the global economy
| | | | Audrey Pate
Italy
Local time: 18:15
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER
Stephen Gobin wrote: Audrey, you could have retorted along the lines that your friend certainly cannot be compared to someone who works in a bank. After all, not even the world's worst translator would have been so successful in causing such wreckage to the global economy
...but it might have shocked him that a Philistine translator like me even knew what global economy was!!!!
| | | | sokolniki
United States
Local time: 11:15
English to Russian
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.. when I worked for a major multinational audit and consulting firm back in Russia - you know - an arrogant 20-something girl from the audit division said that a translator's job is just "technical". I could not resist saying: Look who's talking. And what's the auditor's job about - I mean besides putting "ticks" in the right cells? She shut up immediately.
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| Ignorance and arrogance, never a good mix... | Aug 31, 2011 |
Over the years I was constantly asked the same question.
I never really argued with them, just smiled and moved on. But just for the sake of a experiment, let's see: how much does an average bank teller earn? Because everyone starts there...
Say, $15-$18 per hour? How much will they actually get paid after taxes? How much do they spend on traveling to and from the office? Do they get to work from home and declare half of their household expenses as their work-expenses, including hous... See more Over the years I was constantly asked the same question.
I never really argued with them, just smiled and moved on. But just for the sake of a experiment, let's see: how much does an average bank teller earn? Because everyone starts there...
Say, $15-$18 per hour? How much will they actually get paid after taxes? How much do they spend on traveling to and from the office? Do they get to work from home and declare half of their household expenses as their work-expenses, including house mortgage, car, fuel, internet, computer, printer ink, etc.? I don't think so...
Here in Quebec after you do all this, even a little $15/hr. wage becomes worth the pain.
I worked in a bank as a teller before, earning roughly $19-$20/hr. I calculated that after the tax my net hourly wages were as low as $12-$13/hr.
As a translator and interpreter would I get the privilege of working from home, declaring half of my house (approx.) as office premises with all associated expenditures (see above), and whatever is left would be declared as the actual profit, lowering the real tax bracket to like 10% of the gross income? The answer is: you bet!
A person working at the bank would NEVER make that money given the same amount of effort. They would have to work (in shifts sometimes), hope for promotion and raises, and if they are lucky, maybe in 5-10 years they'd make it, not to mention that they get yelled at by customers, get scrutinized in their work by the management, work in the cubicle daily and endure endless boring hours. Who hasn't heard the famous corporate "is it Friday yet?"
So, does it make sense after all to pay attention to what that ignorant person said?
Exactly... don't think so... ▲ Collapse
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Thirdly, a lot of people in the U.S. are so utterly amazed that you speak one foreign language, let alone two or three, that for the life of them they cannot understand why you are not working for the United Nations or an international law firm or bank.
I don't even live in the U.S., and I get this response at least once a month.
| | | | Evans (X)
Local time: 17:15
Spanish to English
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| respect tinged with derision | Sep 1, 2011 |
I find that most people treat what I do with respect, and are self-deprecating about their own inability to learn another language.
But the flipside of the coin is that they often go on to tell you about incomprehensible 'translated' manuals, signs or posters they have come across. Blaming all of us translators for such nonsense.
I try to explain patiently that such texts have never been near a real translator and that is the problem...
| | | | Mihaela Buruiana
Romania
Local time: 19:15
Member (2011)
English to Romanian
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| Both admiration and condescension | Sep 1, 2011 |
I get both kinds of reactions.
As already said above, some people stand in awe and admiration for anyone who is able to use two or more languages at a proficient level. They also understand that more than mere knowledge of a foreign language is needed to properly translate in a specific field. Not to mention interpreting...
The second reaction mixes arrogance, disrespect and lack of knwoledge. There are some people (fortunately no so many) who look down on translation ... See more I get both kinds of reactions.
As already said above, some people stand in awe and admiration for anyone who is able to use two or more languages at a proficient level. They also understand that more than mere knowledge of a foreign language is needed to properly translate in a specific field. Not to mention interpreting...
The second reaction mixes arrogance, disrespect and lack of knwoledge. There are some people (fortunately no so many) who look down on translation and translators, like this is a job anyone can do and that requires no special skills. They act like "Oh, I'd do it myself, but I'm so important and have no time at all, so I'll have you do it for me", when in fact they picked up the foreign language "by ear" and are by no means qualified to do it, not to mention criticise.
In relation to this second attitude (or should I say misconception?), I've noticed that those who think like this are usually people in high positions, for whom this is simply secretarial work (no offense intended); just like answering phone calls or typing, no great intellectual effort involved!?!?!?
Whenever I can, I take the time and explain what translating involves, but I don't always find receptive ears. And this bothers me, because I want this occupation to gain the recognition and respect it deserves. ▲ Collapse
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| And the next question always is... | Sep 1, 2011 |
"Which languages?"
Sometimes followed by:
"Can you make a living out of it?"
In my experience, I always see a mixture of awe and respect when saying I'm a translator. People here, in Israel, appreciate languages - we're a country of many immigrants, and so translators are seen as people to envy.
BUT, and it's a big one, the way businesses (or generally people who have to pay us for our work) treat us is completely different. For them we are just peopl... See more "Which languages?"
Sometimes followed by:
"Can you make a living out of it?"
In my experience, I always see a mixture of awe and respect when saying I'm a translator. People here, in Israel, appreciate languages - we're a country of many immigrants, and so translators are seen as people to envy.
BUT, and it's a big one, the way businesses (or generally people who have to pay us for our work) treat us is completely different. For them we are just people who dare demanding a fee for just, more or less, typing in another language... Not always, of course, but enough.
Anyway, perhaps the pride I show when saying I'm a translator rubs on those asking... ▲ Collapse
| | | | Ana Malovrh
Slovenia
Local time: 18:15
German to Slovenian
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| people who know and people who don't | Sep 5, 2011 |
It is really interesting to read the attitudes from different countries.
When I say I am a translator, people who don't know the profession and never had to order a translation usually say with admiration: "You surely must earn a lot of money..."
But I have noticed a paradox: my friends who are experts in other fields and have translated themselves (in their field of expertise of course), usually say the translation should be a peace of cake for me, as if I would just ... See more It is really interesting to read the attitudes from different countries.
When I say I am a translator, people who don't know the profession and never had to order a translation usually say with admiration: "You surely must earn a lot of money..."
But I have noticed a paradox: my friends who are experts in other fields and have translated themselves (in their field of expertise of course), usually say the translation should be a peace of cake for me, as if I would just retype the whole thing in another language. Sure, I am familiar with a lot of topics and I can say my vocabulary is a bit over the average, but I still do need time to do the job . I don't even type as fast as some of my friends would expect me to finish.
In Slovenia a lot of people think their English is good enough to be understood and this is all that mattered. When I say I translate from German, some of them usually say: "Oh, I hated German lessons back in school, I was never good at it." So I get admiration for that.
As Mihaela wrote:
There are some people (fortunately no so many) who look down on translation and translators, like this is a job anyone can do and that requires no special skills. They act like "Oh, I'd do it myself, but I'm so important and have no time at all, so I'll have you do it for me", when in fact they picked up the foreign language "by ear" and are by no means qualified to do it, not to mention criticise.
I came across this sort of people too. Unfortunately I saw some translations because I should just edit them and check the grammar. I felt really sorry for them, because in my opinion they appear sloppy in the eyes of their foreign partners. But maybe I'm just too hairsplitting... After all, they actually do make a living despite this attitude. ▲ Collapse
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Re Peter Linton's comment above about praise.
I heard, 'from a reliable source', that the Polish author who was awarded the Nobel Prize in literature a few years ago said that it was thanks to her Swedish translator.
That really is high-level praise.
| | | | Dave Bindon
Greece
Local time: 19:15
Greek to English
In memoriam | Varied reactions | Sep 6, 2011 |
From the English speakers
The general reaction I get from people in the UK is very positive. Most of them have a very limited knowledge of foreign languages and, therefore, consider translators to be 'very clever'. The fact that I translate a language which has a non-Latin alphabet just astounds them: I might as well be translating an obscure dialect of Martian!
The majority of native English speakers living here ... See more From the English speakers
The general reaction I get from people in the UK is very positive. Most of them have a very limited knowledge of foreign languages and, therefore, consider translators to be 'very clever'. The fact that I translate a language which has a non-Latin alphabet just astounds them: I might as well be translating an obscure dialect of Martian!
The majority of native English speakers living here in Greece have a similar view. They've managed to learn a bit of Greek (just enough to get by when shopping, or to understand when their Greek spouse is arranging a trip to the mother-in-law's village) but have struggled all the way, so they really admire the fact that I've progressed much further than they've been able to.
A couple of days ago an English friend (who's lived in Greece for less than a year) told me how much he admired me and respected me for the work that I do. Not only have mutual Greek friends told him that my Greek is excellent ["he knows words that we don't know"], but he's heard me (many, many, many times!) describe the amount of research I do to make sure that my translations are professional, so he's realized that translation isn't an easy thing to do.
My only negative reaction from a native English speaker (living in Athens) was the age-old, "You can't be a good translator if you need to use a dictionary". No comment!
From the Greek speakers
I get "translationism" from a few well-educated Greeks (usually lawyers, doctors, scientists etc) because they feel that their own knowledge of English is so perfect that a translator is entirely superfluous. These are usually the sort of people who have a website which proudly states, "I am doctor since 1999".
Most of my friends here, however, have a lot of respect for me and my work. They know that I'm translating legal texts, medical texts, engineering...you name it!...and they appreciate that they don't even understand the Greek and have no hope of translating it into the English they've learnt from TV and night-school. ▲ Collapse
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Sheila Wilson
Spain
Local time: 17:15
Member (2007)
English
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Peter Linton wrote:
I have just been researching quotations by Eleanor Roosevelt, and found this:
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." That is good advice for translators.
Good advice indeed.
I think it often depends on whether the speaker knows a second language. If they do, then they can generally see the complexities of the job involved and wouldn't want to tackle it themselves, so they see translation as a worthwhile, professional occupation.
Those who don't speak a second language fall into two categories: those who are full of admiration, and those who assume it's simply a mechanical substitution job. After all, how can another language possibly improve upon the structure of their own language? How could it possibly have two words for only one of theirs?
Unfortunately, when you live in a foreign country you tend to see a lot of the latter. My own experience, living in the south of France and translating into English, brings me into contact with a lot of people who studied a very small amount of English at school, many years ago. Some have no hesitation producing their own translations into English, with the help of a dictionary, not even bothering to check past the first translation given, then they feel affronted when you try to point out that it's meaningless drivel. Others simply do not understand why they cannot give me a list of words to translate. If I say I can translate entire paragraphs, why can't I translate individual words? They don't/won't understand the explanation and assume I'm a complete fraud.
Fortunately, they are in the minority and not very present in the world of decision-makers in companies who want to grow. They are the people who appreciate our skills and pay our rates.
Sheila
| | | | jyuan_us
United States
Local time: 12:15
Member (2005)
English to Chinese
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| I think those people who admire translators just | Sep 7, 2011 |
Annett Hieber wrote:
A lot of people around me, be it closer friends, acquaintances or people I only know through other people admire translators for their good command of a foreign language. They are mostly working in other branches, like technicians or as craftsmen and most of them did even forget their school English.
People who are talking like you told us here should be ignored; in my opinion they don't know what they are talking about.
Annett
admire them for their ability in speaking and writing in a foreign language, not for their taking up translation as a profession. I cannot fully organize my thought but I just feel this kind of admiration has nothing to do with what the topic starter had in mind when she asked her question.
[Edited at 2011-09-07 09:00 GMT]
| | | | kmtext
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:15
English
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| "Why bother? Almost everyone speaks English anyway." | Sep 7, 2011 |
is the comment I usually get.
One part of my job means that I end up working with a lot of material that's been translated into English from other languages - apparently by someone who studied English at school for a year and watches American sitcoms, and so is "fluent". A lot of the time it's just gobbledegook, and I'd have done a better job of translating it from the source language myself.
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