| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | Anyone know why we are paying Lionbridge to work with them? Thread poster: sheri abbott
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Sushan Harshe wrote:
I have gone through LionBridges' offer about "translation workspace"; they are offering you web base translation tool "for your translation" and not for there jobs. Further they are suggesting that if qualified, then you may get registered with them, to have there business "too". It clearly indicates that if not qualified then you will not be registered and won't get business from them.
I don't feel anything wrong, in this business.
SDL also offer server TMs at cost.
Hi Sushan,
think about it in a different way. As a freelancer, you don't typically need a server solution: desktop applications will work for you like a charm.
If the client requires you to use their server-based tool (and I think it's quite legitimate for them to do so), then you should be provided with the tool free of charge.
Your comparission with SDL TM server is irrelevant, because if you purchase the TM server, the license stays with you and so do all TMs. With your formulation "if qualified, then you may get registered with them" I have some serious doubts about the security of my and my clients' data...
[Upraveno: 2010-06-04 12:39 GMT]
| | | | Martin Stranak 
Czech Republic
Local time: 18:53
English to Czech
+ ...
| Similar thing in the UK | Jun 4, 2010 |
There is one translation company desperate to get the lowest cost translators in luring people with quotes as "we´ve won the largest government contract", at dumping rates one needs to add.
The issue I´m not very happy with is their CRB check for every translator they decide to "mercifully" award with a job. No travel expenses paid, they still insist everyone should get the higher level CRB before even applying for a job with them. I find this practice rather ridiculous.
| | | | | Maybe they're treating you as an in-house employee | Jun 4, 2010 |
Stanislav Pokorny wrote: Laurent KRAULAND wrote:
There also is/was a French agency which has/had its online translation system.
I only remember one marvelous sentence in their job postings: "We monitor the progress of your translations as well as log-on and log-off times, so do not ever think you will manage to cheat us". Which was followed by "Only professionals, please!" or something of that kind. I wouldn't even think of working for people who openly assume that I'll be cheating them. The important thing for my clients is the deadline: they don't care when I work as long as I deliver the job in time. Isn't it one of the best things about being a translator? Paying for getting a job is one of the most twisted ideas I've ever heard. Even if they paid € 0.3 per word, which they do not. I could think of a different scheme: LB, if you want translators to register with you, pay them a monthly registration fee. How do you like that idea? [Upraveno: 2010-06-04 11:40 GMT]
Regarding Laurent's comments, I couldn't believe my eyes when I read the above quote "do not ever think you will manage to cheat us". Cheat what? How?
Maybe they're treating freelance translators as their in-house employees, except that they don't have to pay benefits, pensions, paid holidays, health care etc. but still "monitor" you when you're eating, working, sleeping or even bathing.
| | | | Krzysztof Kajetanowicz (X)
Poland
Local time: 18:53
English to Polish
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| to be precise | Jun 4, 2010 |
Stanislav Pokorny wrote:
Paying for getting a job is one of the most twisted ideas I've ever heard. Even if they paid € 0.3 per word, which they do not.
Hold on, who are you talking about? Liox?
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Jeff Whittaker
United States
Local time: 12:53
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
+ ...
| So many translators... Not enough TRANSLATORS | Jun 4, 2010 |
I have never worked for Lionbridge, but the fact that they are charging translators to work for them does NOT surprise me at all given the shameful and shocking lack of self-esteem and utter desperation of some translators that I have seen lately. If we do not consider ourselves worthy of respect and learn how to conduct a BUSINESS, why shouldn’t agencies and companies take advantage of us when:
31% never charge extra fees:
<... See more I have never worked for Lionbridge, but the fact that they are charging translators to work for them does NOT surprise me at all given the shameful and shocking lack of self-esteem and utter desperation of some translators that I have seen lately. If we do not consider ourselves worthy of respect and learn how to conduct a BUSINESS, why shouldn’t agencies and companies take advantage of us when:
31% never charge extra fees:
http://www.proz.com/polls/8927
87.9% do not charge a fee for late payments:
http://www.proz.com/polls/646
56% do not belong to any professional organizations:
http://www.proz.com/polls/211
43.7% do not feel the need to charge anything when a job is canceled:
http://www.proz.com/polls/8072
22.7% do not require a purchase order:
http://www.proz.com/polls/898
40% report not having enough work:
http://www.proz.com/polls/9050
21.9% do not have payment terms and another 20% do not enforce them:
http://www.proz.com/polls/7867
75% will work even if they are really sick:
http://www.proz.com/polls/8138
57% are almost fully dependent on agencies for work:
http://www.proz.com/polls/7387
41.5% often work on weekends:
http://www.proz.com/polls/8855
13% accept all projects they are offered:
http://www.proz.com/polls/8852
etc. etc.
[Edited at 2010-06-04 15:39 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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Krzysztof Kajetanowicz wrote: Stanislav Pokorny wrote:
Paying for getting a job is one of the most twisted ideas I've ever heard. Even if they paid € 0.3 per word, which they do not.
Hold on, who are you talking about? Liox?
"Paid" = unreal condition.
| | | | Krzysztof Kajetanowicz (X)
Poland
Local time: 18:53
English to Polish
+ ...
Now that I've re-read your post, I can see "0.3" instead of the "0.03" put there by my imagination. And it all makes sense, of course.
| | | | Laurent KRAULAND (X)
France
Local time: 18:53
French to German
+ ...
| Exercise in realism (OT) | Jun 4, 2010 |
As per the points mentioned by Jeff with reference to recent and less recent polls, I would like to offer a little exercise in realism.
This being: can anyone tell of examples outside the translation industry (and involving equivalent amounts) in which points #2, #4 and #7 are really dealt with in a professional manner i.e.:
#2 - fees for late payments being charged and paid;
#4 - cancelation fees requested and paid;
... See more As per the points mentioned by Jeff with reference to recent and less recent polls, I would like to offer a little exercise in realism.
This being: can anyone tell of examples outside the translation industry (and involving equivalent amounts) in which points #2, #4 and #7 are really dealt with in a professional manner i.e.:
#2 - fees for late payments being charged and paid;
#4 - cancelation fees requested and paid;
#7 - existing payment terms which are effectively enforced. ▲ Collapse
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Erik Freitag
Germany
Local time: 18:53
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
+ ...
Laurent KRAULAND wrote:
As per the points mentioned by Jeff with reference to recent and less recent polls, I would like to offer a little exercise in realism.
This being: can anyone tell of examples outside the translation industry (and involving equivalent amounts) in which points #2, #4 and #7 are really dealt with in a professional manner i.e.:
#2 - fees for late payments being charged and paid;
#4 - cancelation fees requested and paid;
#7 - existing payment terms which are effectively enforced.
I'm not sure what your point is, Laurent. With the possible exception of #4, I'm having a hard time thinking of sectors where these are not charged, enforced, and paid.
| | | | Laurent KRAULAND (X)
France
Local time: 18:53
French to German
+ ...
efreitag wrote:
I'm not sure what your point is, Laurent. With the possible exception of #4, I'm having a hard time thinking of sectors where these are not charged, enforced, and paid.
At least in France, any kind of penalty -and especially late payment interest- is just considered a joke in any sector of activity - that was what I had in mind.
This of course certainly varies from country to country.
Hence my question: who can tell me about concrete examples (*) in which late payment interests are paid (for initial amounts comparable to those invoiced by freelance translators) and what it does take to get paid?
And my final point (that is, if my hypothesis is right) is that points #2, #4 and #7 cannot be seen as indicators of lacking professionalism - or perhaps I am just living in the wrong country or have a biased outlook.
(*) That is: not just affirmations, but proof thereof.
[Edited at 2010-06-05 17:32 GMT]
| | | | farmor
Local time: 18:53
Danish to English
| Why the incredulity? | Jun 5, 2010 |
Yes!
Yes, I know why Lionbridge are charging people to work for (not with) them.
The reason is as clear as day: people are willing to pay for the privilege of being lead like lambs…or should that be lemmings?
So --- why the incredulity?
[Edited at 2010-06-05 09:14 GMT]
| | | | Speranza
Local time: 18:53
Spanish to Russian
+ ...
Jeff,
you got some of these backwards.
When you run a business, you don't get to work 9 to 5, Monday through Friday, and take a sick leave whenever you catch a cold. That's what employees do, not business owners.
Extra fees are a case of inefficient framing. You don't sell pizza for €8/pie to take away or at a 25% surcharge if the patron occupies a table: you sell it at €10 and offer a 20% discount for leaving that table vacant.
As to accep... See more Jeff,
you got some of these backwards.
When you run a business, you don't get to work 9 to 5, Monday through Friday, and take a sick leave whenever you catch a cold. That's what employees do, not business owners.
Extra fees are a case of inefficient framing. You don't sell pizza for €8/pie to take away or at a 25% surcharge if the patron occupies a table: you sell it at €10 and offer a 20% discount for leaving that table vacant.
As to accepting all projects you are offered, consider this. You do enough marketing for people to know in what subjects you specialize. Pricing can't be an issue, because it is you who set your rates. Challenges posed by source text are something you deal with on a daily basis. Sometimes you have to negotiate, and sometimes negotiations are fruitless, so some projects never take off. But why would you simply turn down a request?
What would you think if your dentist told you she refuses appointments to patients because they want to see her about broken legs and suspicious moles and pay her so little that she had to launch a No Peanuts For Dentists website? ▲ Collapse
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| Some thoughts | Jun 6, 2010 |
Nadejda Vega Cespedes wrote:
...Extra fees are a case of inefficient framing. You don't sell pizza for €8/pie to take away or at a 25% surcharge if the patron occupies a table: you sell it at €10 and offer a 20% discount for leaving that table vacant.
I, for one, don't agree that "extra fees are a case of inefficient framing", unless you are quibbling over the semantics of describing these as "extra fees" vs. "higher prices". I have standard rates, and I have higher rates that I will charge for working weekends, rush jobs, overnight jobs, holidays, overtime hours, etc. I will also charge more for having to format a document, for example a long .pdf file with TOC, paragraph numbering, tables, etc. Either way, the clients generally see these as "surcharges".
What I don't do is give them a "discount" for offering me work during normal business hours on weekdays with a reasonable deadline.
As to accepting all projects you are offered, consider this... But why would you simply turn down a request?
Because there are a lot of "clients" out there who don't negotiate, either price or deadline. You can try to change the terms on your end all you want, that doesn't mean you have a "partner" who is listening. Also, in some cases you are not permitted to subcontract, and in many cases it is absolutely not worth the time and effort to do so. So there is absolutely no incentive to "accept" unsuitable jobs.
What would you think if your dentist told you she refuses appointments to patients because they want to see her about broken legs and suspicious moles ...
Uhhhh, I would think she was being absolutely normal and reasonable. Are things different where you are?
| | | | Erik Freitag
Germany
Local time: 18:53
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
+ ...
| Late payment fees are standard practice in Germany | Jun 6, 2010 |
Laurent KRAULAND wrote: efreitag wrote:
I'm not sure what your point is, Laurent. With the possible exception of #4, I'm having a hard time thinking of sectors where these are not charged, enforced, and paid. At least in France, any kind of penalty -and especially late payment interest- is just considered a joke in any sector of activity - that was what I had in mind. This of course certainly varies from country to country. Hence my question: who can tell me about concrete examples (*) in which late payment interests are paid ( for initial amounts comparable to those invoiced by freelance translators) and what it does take to get paid? And my final point (that is, if my hypothesis is right) is that points #2, #4 and #7 cannot be seen as indicators of lacking professionalism - or perhaps I am just living in the wrong country or have a biased outlook. (*) That is: not just affirmations, but proof thereof. [Edited at 2010-06-05 17:32 GMT]
I don't know about the situation in France, but in Germany, late payment fees are standard practice.
I have personally charged (and been paid) late payment fees for my translation services. This probably is just an affirmation, but no proof as you requested, but I'm not going to go as far and make my bookkeeping public.
If you really need a proof, (1) buy anything from a major German mailorder business, (2) don't pay the invoice, and (3) watch what happens!
| | | | Laurent KRAULAND (X)
France
Local time: 18:53
French to German
+ ...
| How it goes (end of OT) | Jun 7, 2010 |
efreitag wrote:
I don't know about the situation in France, but in Germany, late payment fees are standard practice.
I have personally charged (and been paid) late payment fees for my translation services. This probably is just an affirmation, but no proof as you requested, but I'm not going to go as far and make my bookkeeping public.
No need to make your bookkeeping public . From what I heard, some companies will actually pay interests... but deduct the amount of these from the next invoice. That's all. I did not question the fact that late payments fees were standard.
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