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Courszettel

English translation: ignorance about the value of true love

12:22 Aug 21, 2006
German to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Folklore
German term or phrase: Courszettel
Er belächelte die Unwissenheit des Aarburges in dem COURSZETTEL wahrer Minne.

This is taken from a German fairytale written in the 1800s.

The young knight (er) has just told another knight (Aarburg) of his intention to marry his daughter and is being refused on account of his being too poor, as the father suspects him of wanting her for her money. The younger knight goes on to explain how her beauty is worth more to him than all the riches in the world because he is in love.

This what Courszettel is referring to; something to do with accounts and things of value, but I just can't think of a translation that expresses the meaning and fits the period!

A German explanation of the term would be of great assistance, as that will give me a point to move on from. Of course, I wouldn't turn my nose up if someone happened to have the perfect translation, either! Thanks!
Lisa Hoggard
Italy
Local time: 14:28
English translation:ignorance about the value of true love
Explanation:
"It caused him to smile that Aaarburg apparently knew everything about the value of money but nothing about the value of true love."

Kurszettel
(Kursblatt, Kursbericht) Liste der Kurse, die von den amtlichen Börsenbehörden (im Amtlichen Kursblatt) herausgegeben wird.

http://www.wirtschaftslexikon24.net/d/kurszettel/kurszettel....

German-English translations for "Kurszettel {m}Maskulinum (der)":

stock list
stock exchange list
stocklist

http://odge.info/german-english/Kurszettel {m}.html


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Note added at 29 mins (2006-08-21 12:51:51 GMT)
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Minnesang was the tradition of lyric and song writing in Germany which flourished in the 12th century and continued into the 14th century. People who wrote and performed Minnesang are known as Minnesingers (Minnesänger). The name derives from the word minne, Middle High German for love which was their main subject, and an individual song was a minneliet. The Minnesänger were similar to the French troubadours; they wrote love poetry in the courtly love tradition in Middle High German in the High Middle Ages.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesang


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Note added at 48 mins (2006-08-21 13:10:56 GMT)
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belächeln: not a good idea to 'mock' one's future father-in-law. Perhaps 'gave a wry smile'?
Courszettel/Kurszettel: as you point out yourself, the translation needs to be in keeping with the Märchen style so reference to modern financial terminology won't work here.

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Note added at 4 hrs (2006-08-21 17:11:42 GMT)
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"The cynic knows the price of everything and the value of nothing." Oscar Wilde
http://www.quoteworld.org/quotes/10125
Selected response from:

Lancashireman
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:28
Grading comment
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +2ignorance about the value of true love
Lancashireman
2 +2return on securities??
Henry Schroeder
2(customs of)
Erik Freitag


Discussion entries: 2





  

Answers


23 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
(customs of)


Explanation:
I can't give you a translation, but I what comes to my mind when reading the source is something quite different than Henry's and your suggestion: I think "Courszettel wahrer Minne" is a poetic rendering of something like "customs of [wahrer Minne]".

Erik Freitag
Germany
Local time: 14:28
Native speaker of: Native in GermanGerman
PRO pts in category: 4
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

17 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5 peer agreement (net): +2
return on securities??


Explanation:
Here is a definition of sorts I think:

Erster Theil: Die Börse und die Börsengeschäfte. Herausgegeben von R. Siegfried.
Berlin, Haude und Spener, 1878. XV, 715 S., goldgeprägter Original-Leinwand-Band (Einbandkanten stellenweise leicht berieben), kl. 8vo. Zweite berichtigte und ergänzte Ausgabe der dritten Auflage. Behandelt ***'Die Courszettel', den effektiven Ertrag der Papiere,*** 'Die Zeitgeschäfte', 'Die Coursschwankungen', den 'Verkehr in Werthpapieren', die Form der Handelsgesellschaften, 'Die einzelnen Effectengattungen', 'Die Berliner Börse', 'Die Usancen der Berliner Fondbörse' u. a. m.; enthält ein ausführliches alphabetisches Sachregister. - Stellenweise leicht stockfleckig, S. 562/63 fleckig

http://216.239.51.104/search?q=cache:bQQl8zEDRdcJ:www.ilab.o...

I'm not really a financer, so I'm not too sure about the formulation in English, though surely "Papiere" here is "securities"


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Note added at 3 hrs (2006-08-21 16:06:14 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I do also agree that you cannot say "return on securities of true love".

It occured to me that there might also be a play on French "coeur" (heart) and "cour" (Finance-related) here. There is also a French expression, according to leo, faire la cour, which means "to pay attention to a lady". http://dict.leo.org/frde?lp=frde&lang=de&searchLoc=0&cmpType...

In any case I would probably say something like: "He laughed at Aarburg's ignorance about the returns of true love." This would include the potential abiguity of "returns" and sounds quite copacetic.

Henry Schroeder
United States
Local time: 08:28
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Kim Metzger: I think it's a stock certificate. http://www.ilab.org/db/browsebooks.php?lang=ch&membernr=517 http://www.sml.ex.ac.uk/german/gutzkow/NSer/NSer206T.htm
1 min
agree  Erik Macki: Your suggestion "return(s) on true love" is a really nice solution just because it retains some of the financial flavor and connotation that is obvious, and intentional, in the source text.
6 hrs
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23 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
die Unwissenheit in dem COURSZETTEL wahrer Minne.
ignorance about the value of true love


Explanation:
"It caused him to smile that Aaarburg apparently knew everything about the value of money but nothing about the value of true love."

Kurszettel
(Kursblatt, Kursbericht) Liste der Kurse, die von den amtlichen Börsenbehörden (im Amtlichen Kursblatt) herausgegeben wird.

http://www.wirtschaftslexikon24.net/d/kurszettel/kurszettel....

German-English translations for "Kurszettel {m}Maskulinum (der)":

stock list
stock exchange list
stocklist

http://odge.info/german-english/Kurszettel {m}.html


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 29 mins (2006-08-21 12:51:51 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Minnesang was the tradition of lyric and song writing in Germany which flourished in the 12th century and continued into the 14th century. People who wrote and performed Minnesang are known as Minnesingers (Minnesänger). The name derives from the word minne, Middle High German for love which was their main subject, and an individual song was a minneliet. The Minnesänger were similar to the French troubadours; they wrote love poetry in the courtly love tradition in Middle High German in the High Middle Ages.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesang


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 48 mins (2006-08-21 13:10:56 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

belächeln: not a good idea to 'mock' one's future father-in-law. Perhaps 'gave a wry smile'?
Courszettel/Kurszettel: as you point out yourself, the translation needs to be in keeping with the Märchen style so reference to modern financial terminology won't work here.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2006-08-21 17:11:42 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

"The cynic knows the price of everything and the value of nothing." Oscar Wilde
http://www.quoteworld.org/quotes/10125


Lancashireman
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:28
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thanks, Andrew. I was thinking along the same lines as you. The financial terminology helps to understand the concept, but would sound stilted if used in the context. And I would never dream of 'mocking' my future father-in-law! Not the best way to win him over!


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Marketing-Lang.: ...his ignorance of the true worth of love... sounds a bit more "oldy"...
1 hr
agree  Rebecca Garber
3 hrs
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