urspr. Stat.

17:25 Jul 3, 2019 

A follow-up on my earlier discussion entry.
https://www.groovypost.com/howto/disable-google-personalized...

Apologies to anyone not interested; I am posting it because it is relevant to comments made at the beginning of the discussion.

17:17 Jul 3, 2019 

Also, AFAIK this question is still marked Open, but as yet the intensive discussion hasn't been captured in any further Answer(s).

17:15 Jul 3, 2019 

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23:14 Mar 6, 2019 

All's good. As I said, it was confusing to me too. I thought they would post those dates in the proper order, but oh well...

In any case, I hope cedutton has enough to go on now.

Best wishes

11:34 Mar 6, 2019 

Yes, sorry Björn. I was obviously still half asleep. Didn't register that the dates were in the wrong order in your reference.

07:24 Mar 6, 2019 

What nearly tripped me up was that the CH link had the dates the other way (a)round. It says "Ursprüngliches Eintragungsdatum" = 13.03.1978 but "ursprüngliches Statutendatum" = 24.02.1978. The second (Feb.) is earlier than the first (March).

This is in line with what I've been told happens in Switzerland (I know someone who established a company there). First, you get the paperwork to a notary and then you can incorporate it. It's the same here, basically:
"Die eigentliche Gründung erfolgt in Form einer Versammlung der Gründer beim Notar, bei der die vorab eingereichten Unterlagen durchgegangen werden. Sofern allgemeines Einverständnis besteht, wird die Gründung beurkundet und anschliessend im Handelsregister eingetragen...Dieses wird umgehend beim zuständigen kantonalen Handelsregisteramt eingereicht. Das Amt prüft die Dokumente und reicht sie bei Beanstandungen zurück, was dann zu einer zweiten Sitzung beim Notar führt, bei der die beanstandeten Punkte bereinigt werden."
https://www.ijb.ch/firmengrundung/notariatsakt-und-eintragun...

Best

07:20 Mar 6, 2019 

In this case, incorporate is the same as register. You need to file the paperwork first, then they need to verify what you filed and then you can be registered. From the Companies House link below:
"Incorporation is the process by which a new or existing business registers as a limited company...To incorporate your company you must file the following documents:

Application to register a company (form IN01) and the fee
Memorandum of association
Articles of association (unless you adopt model articles in their entirety)"

See also:
"This depends on the date when your trust was incorporated (registered) as a company at Companies House, and not the date when your academy opens."
https://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/tna/2014010718081...

[...]

07:09 Mar 6, 2019 

@ Björn: I'm sticking my neck out here, because I'm not well versed in this field, but would it not be that the company was filed (or registered) on the first date and incorporated on the second?

16:26 Mar 5, 2019 

Feel free to post an answer, since you found the relevant doc.

Best wishes

16:24 Mar 5, 2019 

Still, I think it's an important piece of information because when I was writing my post this morning, I was a bit puzzled about Statutendatum--as a compound noun--being abbreviated to Stat.

While the outcome may be the same, your (shortened) Statuten is a better match (in German).

Almost didn't remember this, but one point this morning was:
"Ursprüngliches Eintragungsdatum im Handelsregister des Kantons Zürich: 13.03.1978; ursprüngliches Statutendatum: 24.02.1978."
https://www.easymonitoring.ch/handelsregister/spherotech-ag-...

So, I think it's that you incorporated (registered) the company on the first date (March) and filed/adopted articles of association earlier (February):
"If the documents satisfy all the appropriate examination checks, we will incorporate the company, issue a certificate of incorporation and place the documents on the company record for public inspection. The incorporation does not take effect until Companies House has issued the certificate of incorporation."
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/incorporation-and...

That's actually more in line with what I've been told than what I said below. Nearly forgot that.

Best

15:55 Mar 5, 2019 

Yes, that's why I said small point, as I agree that it doesn't make too much difference here.
As for incorporated on, I think that is OK, with any following entries then being as amended, as here:
MEMORANDUM AND ARTICLES OF ASSOCIATION INCORPORATED 16 JUNE 1976 AS AMENDED 26 NOVEMBER 1976, etc.
http://beta.charitycommission.gov.uk/charity-details/?regid=...

14:44 Mar 5, 2019 

That makes sense! Though, for all intents and purposes, I don't believe it makes much of a difference in this case, since the date is what follows?

They do translate it as "date of the acts" too :(

Would you think the Companies House's "incorporated on" is OK? As it was explained to me this morning, it should be. See Tesco link in the 3rd d-box post.

Best wishes

14:38 Mar 5, 2019 

I would say that urspr. Stat. stands for ursprüngliche Statuten (the term original refers to the Articles of Association rather than the date). See it written out in full in this example, where you can also click to see a PDF of the extract:
https://sh.chregister.ch/cr-portal/auszug/auszug.xhtml?uid=C...

14:10 Mar 5, 2019 

But acts is what led me astray because it's totally wrong here. So is "statutes," which thankfully no one has posted till now.

This morning, I talked to family living in Switzerland, by the way, and if I understood it correctly, the Statutendatum is when you file all the documents with a notary.

The LEO suggestion (bylaws) is wrong as well, IMO. I don't put much faith in this database anway. It should be AoAs in your case (or Articles of Organization if it's an American LLC). The Wiki article needs some cleaning up, but this paragraph seems OK:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Articles_of_association#Other_...

Cf. https://smallbusiness.chron.com/difference-between-articles-...

Best

14:04 Mar 5, 2019 

See it as a "tease," nothing more. Since you seem to be new here, I'd like to explain that while we do have several askers who don't seem to search much before posting questions, I've noted on several occasions that search engines may produce different results depending on your preferences, etc. So, we may look for the same thing, but one of us can't find it. Also, if I were really annoyed, I wouldn't have posted something like half an hour after you asked (so you could continue working, which I need to do still too).

In response to your question: Now, I'm not sure what you mean :)

My German link says "Statutendatum" in the first line (which means the second is just a repeat of the first, regardless of whether it's abbreviated).

The aim of posting an ENS link was to show you the general info regarding a UK entry. I'm not sure how much that helps; I did click on our profile, but I couldn't find any clue as to what variant of English you need.

I'm a bit concerned, though, because of the headings. You get the same EN translation, including "acts," if you follow my first link and click the button in the right upper-hand corner of the page to change the language.

[...]

12:20 Mar 5, 2019 

@Björn There appears to be an insuation that I have not looked for the answer myself prior to posting, however this is not true. When I search for "urspr. Stat" in Google, Google says "did you mean..." and there aren't any relevant hits.

I'm not sure why you have shared the link to the commerical register as it doesn't appear to contain "Statutendatum"? I do however agree that urspr. Stat. = ursprüngliches Statutendatum so thank you.

10:02 Mar 5, 2019 

Thanks, Maja and I'll revise my post:
"Neben dem Namen der Gesellschaft mit beschränkter Haftung werden in dem Handelsregister auch der Unternehmenssitz sowie das Statutendatum der GmbH eingetragen. Dieses Statutendatum ist gleichzusetzen mit dem Gründungsdatum der Gesellschaft mit beschränkter Haftung. Auch der eigentliche Zweck der GmbH wird im Handelsregister eingetragen."
https://www.adauctus-gmbh.ch/de/faq-was-beinhaltet-der-hande...

Not sure what they want with "acts" here in English?

Here's the UK's Companies House (like a Handelsregister in German):
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00445790

See also
https://www.proz.com/kudoz/german/certificates-diplomas-lice...

09:32 Mar 5, 2019 

Nevertheless, just place it as an official answer :D

09:15 Mar 5, 2019 

Come on, it's the first link that pops up in my G search; can't be much different for you.


"Ref Statutendatum
0 urspr.Stat. 08.04.1986
1 19.06.1997
4 18.04.2008"
https://ag.chregister.ch/cr-portal/auszug/auszug.xhtml;jsess...

urspr. Stat. = ursprüngliches Statutendatum