Finanz- und Betriebsbuchhaltung

English translation: Financial and internal cost accounting/Financial and management accounting

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

German term or phrase:	Finanz- und Betriebsbuchhaltung
English translation:	Financial and internal cost accounting/Financial and management accounting
Entered by:	Sebastian Witte

09:44 Apr 6, 2019

German to English translations [PRO]
Bus/Financial - Accounting / Internes und externes Rechnungswesen des Unternehmens?

German term or phrase: Finanz- und Betriebsbuchhaltung

Dear all,

I can see that Linguee has various more or less relevant translations of this term.

I am, however, looking for:

- a linguistically somewhat catchy pair of two terms linked by "and" nicely forming one expression as this is for the Swiss, where "good" is not enough
- a technically more accurate translation than what EUR-LEX can do for well-informed or expert users of English accounting materials. This does not mean I wouldn't consider its translations like "financial and management accounting", I just would like to receive feedback from people who usually know more about accounting in the German-speaking countries and about IFRS English (there are no governing accounting regulations here as this is from a Swiss judgment in a main trademark case but still ...) than QA people at EUR-LEX do
- an alternative to clumsy, possibly even near-translatorse like "operational accounting" for the second component of the expression concerned

I am looking into the following draft translations, but am obviously not restricted to using any of them:
Financial and cost accounting
Financial and management accounting
External and internal corporate accounting

Context: wording is confidential. But it basically says there that the Court is ordering the party concerned in the trademark case to render accounts in line with generally accepted accounting principles, based on that party's ***Finanz- und Betriebsbuchhaltung***, on the cost (well, "Umsätze", actually, but the cost billed is basically the gist of that) billed for any maintenance and repair services provided in Switzerland in regard to the goods designated with the trademark at issue.

Cheers,

Sebastian Witte

Sebastian Witte KudoZ activity Questions: 1501 (2 open) (73 closed without grading) Answers: 1077 Germany
Local time: 21:45

(CH) Financial and (Internal) Cost Accounting

Explanation:
Typing goes haywire. So I can't post any explanation.

The 'account of profit(s)' to be rendered in an English law claim for the legal and equitable 'relief sought' would not specify the type of book-keeping or accounting rules.

Betriebsbuchhaltung > 'shop accounting' (Robert Herbst's CH FR/DE/EN dictionary of finance and law), ha, ha!

Selected response from:

Adrian MM.
Austria

Grading comment

Adding internal is a good idea. Gabler link was helpful. I don't really understand Jeff's explanation in that I do not think it's very plausible or the most logical explanation ever provided, in particular compared to how your Gabler encyclopedia entry defines Betriebsbuchhaltung. His translation should be correct, though.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

5 +1

financial and management accounting

Jeff Barter

4 +1

(CH) Financial and (Internal) Cost Accounting

Adrian MM.

Discussion entries: 8

Sebastian Witte

Germany

ASKER

17:32 Apr 6, 2019

True, true :)

michael10705 (X)

17:32 Apr 6, 2019

Pleasure...Problem is, I can't think of anything very "catchy" offhand that reflects what the intended meaning is..."accounting" and "catchy" are, unfortunately, not typically mentioned in the same breath :)

Sebastian Witte

Germany

ASKER

15:43 Apr 6, 2019

Thanks very much, Michael. I appreciate the relevant in-depth knowledge.

michael10705 (X)

15:33 Apr 6, 2019

I'm not quite as certain about using the the terms "cost accounting," "management accounting, and "internal accounting" interchangeably in all instances. Cost accounting is more specifically focused on costs / cost control and allocation - it is a part of management accounting. And not all internal accounting is necessarily management accounting, as certain internal accounting records may be maintained purely for reconciliation or tracking purposes at a lower level and never enter the scope of internal reporting to management.

Sebastian Witte

Germany

ASKER

09:56 Apr 6, 2019

The usual phrase in trademark law briefs and judgments for "Umsätze" in that type of clause is "sales achieved with" or "turnovers achieved with", however, I somehow felt you might wish to deviate from that standard wording here. However, "sales achieved with" would not only be understood here (i.e. what they charged for the maintenance and repair services in total), but also not be completely off in terms of English style in the context at hand. So take your pick.

Sebastian Witte

Germany

ASKER

Cont'd

09:51 Apr 6, 2019

... Financial accountants need to understand cash flow, tax liabilities, turnover, profit margins and the like."

https://medium.com/trust-works/differences-between-cost-acco...

Sebastian Witte

Germany

ASKER

Is this a reliable resource, do you folks think?

09:49 Apr 6, 2019

"Differences between financial and cost accounting
Some of the other differences between financial accounting and cost accounting include:

Financial accountants generally report their findings to both internal parties (managers and executives) and external parties (stockholders, IRS) whilst cost accountants only report their findings internally.
Financial accounting is primarily a reporting and controlling business function whilst cost accounting is a function aimed at making the business more efficient through driving change.
Cost accounting is normally used to help the business make tactical decisions to improve business processes whilst financial accounting helps the business to understand its overall financial performance.
Financial accounting provides standard reports, normally in a predefined format that can be used by many different areas to understand the financial responsibilities of the business. Reports from cost accounting are normally designed to provide information in very specific areas and to allow managers and executives to make decisions as a result.
Cost accountants need to understand the details of business processes including inputs, outputs and resources. ...

Sebastian Witte

Germany

ASKER

Typo

09:47 Apr 6, 2019

That should say "- an alternative to clumsy, possibly even near-translatorEse like "operational accounting" for the second component of the expression concerned".

Answers

1 hr confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

(CH) Financial and (Internal) Cost Accounting

Das Ressort Betriebsbuchhaltung erbringt Finanz-Dienstleistungen im strategischen Bereich zugunsten des ganzen Amtes, insbesondere aber der Führung. swisstopo.admin.ch The Internal cost-accounting provides financial services in strategic areas
The payment of actual damages can range from a court judgment to expenses incurred in hiring a *forensic accountant* to evaluate the plaintiff and defendant's financial records.

Reference: http://wirtschaftslexikon.gabler.de/definition/betriebsbuchh...

Adrian MM.
Austria
Meets criteria
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 25

Grading comment

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thanks, guys.

20 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

financial and management accounting

Explanation:
Financial accounting is classical bookkeeping
Management accounting covers all aspects of financial mamgement relating to commerce, business and industry

I should know as I am a chartered management accountant (ACMA)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 20 hrs (2019-04-07 06:08:03 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

see my expalanation above

Jeff Barter
Germany
Local time: 21:45
Meets criteria
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 16

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thank you.

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Finanz- und Betriebsbuchhaltung

English translation: Financial and internal cost accounting/Financial and management accounting

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English translation: Financial and internal cost accounting/Financial and management accounting

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