sur toute son étendue

English translation: (rephrase it)

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:sur toute son étendue
English translation:(rephrase it)
Entered by: angela3thomas

19:22 Aug 5, 2017
French to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Archaeology / ancient art
French term or phrase: sur toute son étendue
Hi again!
DOC: 1907 Museum catalog of ancient Egyptian mirrors.
CONTEXT: Si l'on observe par la tranche les miroirs convexes, on remarque que, indépendamment du centre qui présente un renflement bien caractérisé, le pourtour n'a pas ***sur toute son étendue*** une épaisseur uniforme, qu'il est généralement plus fort aux deux pôles, comme si la protubérance du centre se prolongeait en s'atténuant bien entendu suivant l'axe vertical.
ATTEMPT: When convex mirrors are viewed from the edge on, it can be observed that, apart from the center which has a well-defined bulge, the periphery? has no uniform thickness ***over its whole area*** and that it is generally greater at both poles, as if the protuberance at the center was extended by gradually diminishing, of course, along the vertical axis.
ISSUE: I've no idea what this means here or how to translate it, it seems to be somewhat of an idiom? Could it be something like the thickness of the entire periphery varies throughout?
Thanks in advance for any clarification!
angela3thomas
United States
(rephrase it)
Explanation:
The text is saying, in essence, that the edge (or rim, perhaps) is of uniform width (or height, given that it’s being looked at ‘edgewise’), except at the poles (where the gradually diminishing extension of the bulge makes it a bit wider (higher).

If you leave it out, as Phil suggests, the translation will end up suggesting that the edge/rim is of "irregular" width (height) – that would be incorrect. It is ‘variable’, not ‘irregular’ – and the widest parts are at points that cannot be regarded as random, since they are at the poles.

I think you’ll have to rephrase it English, something like this:

le pourtour n'a pas sur toute son étendue une épaisseur uniforme, qu'il est généralement plus fort aux deux poles, ...
-->
the edge is of uniform width for the most part, but generally exhibits an increase at each pole. ...


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2017-08-05 22:01:55 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The entire ST as quoted tells us that this refers to an elliptical mirror, since a circular mirror would have a uniform rim thickness "sur toute son étendue".

In response to Phil’s comments below:
- I didn’t say you said anything was ‘irregular’ – I only suggested that your translation leaves that as a posible (mis)interpretation.
- Well, yes, the ST says “épaisseur”. That doesn’t necessarily make width (or even height) wrong. It's a question of orientation of the object and the observer's viewpoint.
- ‘pole’ is a mathematical term relating to the geometry of an ellipse, and cannot be translated as top/bottom (why not turn the mirror 90º degrees clockwise and say left/right?)

That said, regarding "pole", I wonder if the ST is perpetuating a common error, and using ‘pôle’ to refer to the points where the major axis passes through the ellipse (in effect using 'pôle' in the sense used in when referring to the poles of a planet: noth pole, south pole). Even if that is the case, then it will be best to reproduce the error in the translation rather than trying to second-guess the ST author's intent/knowledge.
Selected response from:

Jennifer Levey
Chile
Local time: 05:22
Grading comment
Thank you so much!
Thanks to all who participated as well.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +3leave it out
philgoddard
4 +1(rephrase it)
Jennifer Levey


Discussion entries: 5





  

Answers


19 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +3
leave it out


Explanation:
You can just say "the edge varies in thickness".

philgoddard
United States
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 52

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Tony M
7 mins

agree  Yolanda Broad
1 hr

agree  Nikki Scott-Despaigne
6 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
(rephrase it)


Explanation:
The text is saying, in essence, that the edge (or rim, perhaps) is of uniform width (or height, given that it’s being looked at ‘edgewise’), except at the poles (where the gradually diminishing extension of the bulge makes it a bit wider (higher).

If you leave it out, as Phil suggests, the translation will end up suggesting that the edge/rim is of "irregular" width (height) – that would be incorrect. It is ‘variable’, not ‘irregular’ – and the widest parts are at points that cannot be regarded as random, since they are at the poles.

I think you’ll have to rephrase it English, something like this:

le pourtour n'a pas sur toute son étendue une épaisseur uniforme, qu'il est généralement plus fort aux deux poles, ...
-->
the edge is of uniform width for the most part, but generally exhibits an increase at each pole. ...


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2017-08-05 22:01:55 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The entire ST as quoted tells us that this refers to an elliptical mirror, since a circular mirror would have a uniform rim thickness "sur toute son étendue".

In response to Phil’s comments below:
- I didn’t say you said anything was ‘irregular’ – I only suggested that your translation leaves that as a posible (mis)interpretation.
- Well, yes, the ST says “épaisseur”. That doesn’t necessarily make width (or even height) wrong. It's a question of orientation of the object and the observer's viewpoint.
- ‘pole’ is a mathematical term relating to the geometry of an ellipse, and cannot be translated as top/bottom (why not turn the mirror 90º degrees clockwise and say left/right?)

That said, regarding "pole", I wonder if the ST is perpetuating a common error, and using ‘pôle’ to refer to the points where the major axis passes through the ellipse (in effect using 'pôle' in the sense used in when referring to the poles of a planet: noth pole, south pole). Even if that is the case, then it will be best to reproduce the error in the translation rather than trying to second-guess the ST author's intent/knowledge.


Jennifer Levey
Chile
Local time: 05:22
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 12
Grading comment
Thank you so much!
Thanks to all who participated as well.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  philgoddard: I didn't say anything about it being irregular. The French says the edge varies in thickness (not width), and is thicker at the poles. (I'd say "top and bottom", rather than "poles".)
28 mins
  -> Please see noted under my answer.

agree  Tony M: Yes, though do note here it is the MINOR axis (i.e. N/S poles) — the Earth being in fact an oblate spheroid; this has been explained in previous questions from this Asker.
10 hrs
  -> Thanks Tony. ‘minor’, in the case of the Earth, yes of course. But a flat geometrical ellipse has 4 (faux) poles, at each end of both minor and major axes. In the ST context, it more likely refers to the major axis (think about it in 3D).
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