Dus ...

10:15 Feb 9, 2011

Dutch to English translations [Non-PRO]
Art/Literary - Poetry & Literature / Dutch idiomatic filler word equivalent ...

Dutch term or phrase: Dus ...

I know what "dus" means. And I have checked the ProZ database for previous discussion on what must be a very frequent topic.

The problem is that this children's book (10 year old) being translated into AMERICAN English has a character (young boy of 10) who peppers his speech with "dus" everywhere. There are a number of filler words that I can use as an American equivalent: "like" "you now" and so on, as well as the mainstream words of "thus" and "so". But the problem is that I cannot think of an American English equivalent in the lexicon of 10 year olds that is used as frequently as "dus" is being used by this character. Changing all occurrences to "like", "you know", "so", "thus" and any other combination, still looks terribly unnatural for the American dialogue.

I am aware that the translators here have discussed the usage. But I am beginning to come to the conclusion in the context of the work I am tackling now, this constant peppering of "dus" might be idiomatically untranslatable, and that the best thing is to translate it occasionally when the appropriate American English filler word can be used, but it might also be best just not to translate it every time.

(I hear this filler peppering usage all the time with Dutch youth, and of course it is famously encapsulated by postbode Simon, Ingrid and Irma in the "Zaai" television program. I am aware of what it is being used for. Just ... now translate that to current American youth street language).

Here are some examples from the text:

"Hij schoof een pen naar me toe. ‘Hier,’ zei hij. ‘Deze schrijft extra lekker. Dus.’"

"Hij vertrok geen spier. ‘Ik heet Sasha en ik ben heel rijk. Dus."

"‘Ik ben heel rijk en we hebben een heel groot huis en een tuin met twee reuzehonden die Kwijltje en Baars heten. Dus.’"

"Ik wilde nee zeggen, maar knikte ja. Mijn vader was toch stom. Dus."

"De school is verhuisd, de rest is gebleven. Dus."

And in one last example, the young lad is sitting on a swing in a park and his sole word is:

"Dus."

That last one is the REAL challenge.

Thank you for your attention ...

Dave Cooper (X) KudoZ activity Questions: 20 (none open) (1 without valid answers) (1 closed without grading) Answers: 0 Netherlands
Local time: 06:21

Summary of answers provided

3 +4

See or okay

Rene Engelbrecht

4 +1

So...

Lianne van de Ven

There you go

ineke meijer

okay / right

Chris Hopley

Discussion entries: 11

Francina

United States

Duh!

12:39 Feb 11, 2011

Suggestion. Good luck!
F

Suzan Hamer

Netherlands

Bazinga! ?

19:04 Feb 9, 2011

A bit far out, but I suppose it could be used in all of the situations you described, and have slightly different implications depending on the tone of voice....
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bazinga

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/4121704/sheldon_bazinga/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qn2S7fq_p1E&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CcVDfnsc2c

Barend van Zadelhoff

Netherlands

Good luck !

14:49 Feb 9, 2011

Interesting and challenging task.

Dave Cooper (X)

Netherlands

ASKER

14:29 Feb 9, 2011

Barend. This is a damn difficult one, y'gnome sayin' ... this idiom as a universal singular word is almost impossible to translate to American English. There ARE a number of words I could use, but never the same single word as the Dutch language is capable of here. It will be careful work, but I think I can do it with all the help and suggestions from here on ProZ and elsewhere (I am asking around a lot, both here in NL and Stateside ... with adults and with kids of the adults I know ... including my own boy back in San Francisco).

The hardest one is when the character in the book sits alone on a swing in a park and says "Dus." Just the one word. Sort of makes me think he is saying what an American kid might say in those pubescent melancholic and philosophic circumstance as: "Huh." or "Yeah, right" or "Okaaaay" or "Dang".

Imagine what a mess machine translation would make of this! Herein is why we need human translators.

Barend van Zadelhoff

Netherlands

dus

14:09 Feb 9, 2011

I am not sure what would be the best American equivalent of the Dutch word 'dus' used in the sense I suggest it is here.
I should say: I am not sure what would be the best register here.
I am sure 'so' is American English (but also British English) and I am also sure American kids would understand the word 'so' :-)

It may well be that boys of this age use the word 'dus' frequently but when I look at all the sentences you offered as examples then I think this use of 'dus' is deliberately introduced into the guy's speech

This is of course only my take on it

Dave Cooper (X)

Netherlands

ASKER

13:51 Feb 9, 2011

Barend ... Actually in my 10 years of living in the Netherlands, I have heard and still hear kids speaking exactly like this and adding "dus" as frequently as this.

I understand your point in what you propose the author might be doing, but still the word or the intention needs to be translated to the American English of a 10 year old. Or it needs to be skillfully avoided to resolve the English translation.

There is an equivalent in Chavspeak in modern British English:

"innit" (which you can hear on the streets of Britain or remotely via the BBC with the likes of Catherine Tate, Armstrong & Miller [RAF airmen], Little Britain and many others)

Barend van Zadelhoff

Netherlands

dus

13:39 Feb 9, 2011

I believe this character presented here is not someone you would come across in the street but is a fictional character.
[So] the question we need to ask is why has the author him talk this way? I believe the author wants to make this guy sound funny and adds 'dus' to any sentence he utters to create a sort of 'comically pompous' air about him as if everything he were saying had some logical implication

perhaps at this age kids find out about the power of logic and now this author tries to show them how 'comically pompous' the use of this power can be

anyway, I believe the author makes this guy add 'SO' to any sentence he utters
I also believe you must not ask what 'kids' would say but that you must maintain this deliberately created 'weird' piece of behaviour: SO ...

Dave Cooper (X)

Netherlands

ASKER

12:33 Feb 9, 2011

Suzan ... Yes, I know about "you know what I'm sayin'" (which I believe originates from "Ebonics" or rappers or both) and which I like to playfully spell as:

"y'gnome sayin'"

(I should copyright that, I say smugly ... [stupid smiling winking thingie here] )

I have thought about using that, where appropriate. And yes, the URBAN DICTIONARY" is a good resource for stuff like that. Unfortunately there is no Dutch version of the URBAN DICTIONARY, or is there?

Suzan Hamer

Netherlands

11:51 Feb 9, 2011

I agree with Lianne that you probably want just one word, but I'm thinking that American kids (perhaps older than 10) use "you know what I mean?" ("nowadimeen") or "you know what I'm sayin'" in a similar way.//Oh dear. Just took a look at Urban Dictionary: "'know what I'm saying?': used by idiots and fools after every other word in a sentance when they have no idea what they are talking about." Never mind then.

Josephine Isaacs (X)

Australia

10:27 Feb 9, 2011

I don't know about American English, but in Australia "so" would be appropriate. Children use it a lot.

Lianne van de Ven

United States

So.

10:25 Feb 9, 2011

You obviously need one word, not a variety of interjections. I think I'd try 'so' wherever it fits, even if not in the same sentences, but rather to get the point accross, and keep an equivalent number of them. So.

Answers

6 mins confidence:

There you go

Explanation:
I am not sure if this is something children would use as a filler, since is is a lot more text than 'dus'.

ineke meijer
Netherlands
Local time: 06:21
Native speaker of: Dutch

The asker has declined this answer

9 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +4

See or okay

Explanation:
This might just help.

Example sentence(s):

This pen writes well. See/Okay

Rene Engelbrecht
South Africa
Local time: 06:21
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

Afrikaans,

English

The asker has declined this answer

13 mins confidence:

okay / right

Explanation:
The only words I can think of that might work here - including as a sole utterance - are 'right' or 'okay'. Dus vandaar ;-)

Chris Hopley
Netherlands
Local time: 06:21
Native speaker of: English

The asker has declined this answer

5 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

So...

Explanation:
I would not use any translation that changes 'dus' into anything with a question mark (like innit suggests). Dus is rather pensive. You probably have info, Dave, about the tone of the rest of the book, but I am not picking up too much about 'on the streets' that the urban dictionary typically would be good for. I think with your character sitting on a swing saying 'dus' all to himself reinforces the pensive 'dus' or 'so'.
I think Barend makes a very good point about the character's age and discovering logic. Good luck.

Lianne van de Ven
United States
Local time: 00:21
Native speaker of:

Dutch
PRO pts in category: 8

Notes to answerer

Asker: Lianne ... (I just tried to send this answer to you via Chrome browser and nothing happened, so I am trying again with Mozilla Firefox). Thanks for all your help and insight. I would not use "innit" here because "innit" is not American. This Chavspeak British English term has been reduced to a fairly neutral ending utterance, it has lost its questioning character even though obviously it does originate from "isn't it". You can hear it in use on the streets of English towns and cities or on television shows such as Catherine Tate (as Lauren Cooper and her gang), Little Britain's Vicky Pollard, or the RAF Airmen in Armstrong & Miller. I will keep this open a little longer and see what else comes up.

The asker has declined this answer

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