geldt .. dat hij niet heeft ontleend.

English translation: Then *applies that it would have been up to XXX to prove/show that he did not plagiarise*

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Dutch term or phrase:Daarbij *geldt dat het aan XXX zou zijn geweest (te bewijzen/aan te tonen) dat hij niet heeft ontleend.
English translation:Then *applies that it would have been up to XXX to prove/show that he did not plagiarise*
Entered by: Fred ten Berge

21:08 Mar 16, 2005
Dutch to English translations [PRO]
Law: Patents, Trademarks, Copyright
Dutch term or phrase: geldt .. dat hij niet heeft ontleend.
Niet alleen de verhaallijn in de beide musicals, maar ook de situering in de tijd, de verteller, de plaats, de karakters, de intrige/plot, de voortgang in de verwikkelingen en de climax zijn in de beide musicals identiek. Dat is natuurlijk geen toeval. Daarbij geldt dat het aan XXX zou zijn geweest dat hij níet heeft ontleend (Hoge Raad Shoppingspel, NJ 2000, 309).

I don't really need a translation I just need to know what it means in Dutch to be able to translate this. Very confusing sentence :-(
Iris70
Local time: 23:12
In that case...
Explanation:
I think there is something missing in that sentence:

Daarbij geldt dat het aan XXX zou zijn geweest <om te bewijzen> dat hij niet heeft ontleend.

In that case (the rule is that) it would have been up to XXX to prove that he did not plagiarize.
Selected response from:

Tina Vonhof
Canada
Local time: 15:12
Grading comment
Got it right this time:-) thanks again Tina (and Fred)
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +5In that case...
Tina Vonhof
3 +1Then *applies* that it would have been up to XXX *to prove/show that he did not plagiarise.*
Fred ten Berge
2 +2thereby applies that it was up to XXX not to plagiarize....
Ariser


Discussion entries: 5





  

Answers


54 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5 peer agreement (net): +2
thereby applies that it was up to XXX not to plagiarize....


Explanation:
This might pertain to opportunity and means? Two authors, each create a musical, but maybe XXX was the only one of the two who had the opportunity to plagiarize.
Daarbij geldt dat het aan XXX zou zijn geweest dat hij níet heeft ontleend.
Bovendien was het XXX die de mogelijkheid had te ontlenen (to borrow from ---> to copy, hence to plagiarize)

Ariser
Native speaker of: Native in DutchDutch, Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Fred ten Berge: enige logica missing?! // the addition of some phrase along the lines of 'to prove / to show' appeared logical!
5 hrs
  -> Agree, that was my first hunch too, but the sentence seemed open to much interpretation. Thank you.

agree  jarry (X): (Post grading) 'Thereby applies' is an awkward (unnatural) English translation of "Daarbij geldt". I would have said something like: 'It would also have been up to ... XXX to. Googling and linguistic skills are two very, very different things.
9 hrs
  -> Thank you for the heads-up.

agree  Marijke Mayer: Ik vond genoeg Google hits voor "Thereby applies" . . . .
9 hrs
  -> Thank you
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +5
In that case...


Explanation:
I think there is something missing in that sentence:

Daarbij geldt dat het aan XXX zou zijn geweest <om te bewijzen> dat hij niet heeft ontleend.

In that case (the rule is that) it would have been up to XXX to prove that he did not plagiarize.

Tina Vonhof
Canada
Local time: 15:12
Native speaker of: Native in DutchDutch, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 16
Grading comment
Got it right this time:-) thanks again Tina (and Fred)

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Fred ten Berge: Had je uitleg gemist toen ik reageerde. Quite correct, in my opinion!
4 hrs
  -> Thanks Fred.

agree  Deborah do Carmo: well spotted
7 hrs
  -> Thanks Debbie.

agree  jarry (X): (Post grading) 'In that case' / 'the rule is that' sounds like much better English to me
9 hrs
  -> I agree, but you know how it goes...

agree  Marijke Mayer: I can't see anything wrong with 'in that case',
9 hrs
  -> Thanks Marijke.

agree  Ariser
16 hrs
  -> Thank you.
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5 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
Daarbij *geldt .. dat hij niet heeft ontleend.*
Then *applies* that it would have been up to XXX *to prove/show that he did not plagiarise.*


Explanation:
Unfortunately, in legal texts, even of great importance, omissions of this nature are not uncommon.

Bijzonder raadzaam om bij opdrachtgever te verifieren!

Alternative spelling 'plagiarize' depends, of course, on consistency.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 hrs 6 mins (2005-03-17 03:15:22 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Tina heeft m.i. helemaal gelijk.
Voor haar de KUDOZ, en vooral alle eer en waardering.

Fred ten Berge
Local time: 23:12
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in DutchDutch
PRO pts in category: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  jarry (X): (Post grading) 'Then applies' is an awkward (unnatural) English translation of "Daarbij geldt". I would have said something like: 'It would also have been up to ... XXX to. Googling and linguistic skills are two very, very different things.
4 hrs
  -> Thanks Jarry, for correction/option!

agree  Marijke Mayer: Foei, toch Fred :-), maar wat heet goed Engels, ik vond wel 136.000 Google hits voor "the applies"
4 hrs
  -> Thanks Marijke!
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