turn of the century

English translation: in and out of context

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
English term or phrase:turn of the century
Selected answer:in and out of context
Entered by: Roddy Stegemann

06:33 Jan 2, 2005
English language (monolingual) [PRO]
Poetry & Literature / The passage of time
English term or phrase: turn of the century
When we refer to the turn of a given century in English, do we refer to the one that came just before the turn, or the one that came just after? Or, are we forever condemned to find the answer in context?
Roddy Stegemann
United States
Local time: 13:48
turn of the century that just ended
Explanation:
My understanding is that when you say "turn of the 20th century", you are talking about the end of the 20th century/ beginning of the 21st century. I don't think it depends on context - I believe this is the correct usage. If you make a search on the internet for "turn of the 19th century", you will find sites that talk about the late 19th/ early 20th century, not the late 18th/early 19th century.

It's like when you refer to a page of a book you are turning. Turning page 5 ("the turn of page 5" so to speak) would mean that you're going over to page 6. Otherwise, it would be "Turning TO page 5".

Hope that answers your question.
Selected response from:

Nesrin
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:48
Grading comment
If all answers to mine and others' questions were like your answers to this one, I would be extremely pleased.

Acknowledgments: I would like to thank Nesrin for rendering clear my question to those who were confused about it. I would also like to thank Linda and Laurel for stressing the importance of duration. Please allow me to express my gratitude to cyrus-abd and our fellow contributor Dusty for their reaffirmation of Nesrin's contribution. Indeed, the expression in question does appear to indicate the end of the "out-going" and beginning of the in-coming centuries. Juvera's comment with regard to the use of the term in the absence of specific mention of a century is also greatly appreciated. Jonathan's contribution in this regard and his additional comment with regard to the term's adjectival use were, of course, very helpful. Thanks also go to Peter, Joergen, importal, and others for their supporting evidence. Finally, and certainly not least, my very best wishes to Humbird for getting everything off to a confusing start and thus provoking interesting dialogue -- Happy Hazuhinode!

With these acknowledgments I wish you and most other ProZians a very Happy New Year! That we continue to turn the page of each day with a better understanding of each other's languages and cultures.

Hamo in Hong Kong
January 2005
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



SUMMARY OF ALL EXPLANATIONS PROVIDED
4 +5turn of the century that just ended
Nesrin
5 +3Context
lindaellen (X)
5 +1entering into a new century and end of the other
Kourosh Abdi
3 +2See comment below...
Tony M
4transition to one cetury to another
humbird
2 +1end of 19th/beginning of 20th century
Jonathan MacKerron


Discussion entries: 7





  

Answers


25 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
transition to one cetury to another


Explanation:
Turn of the century refers to a transition of one cetury to another, namely from 19th century to 20th century, from 20th century to 21st, for instance. In other words, turn of century means year 1899 to year 1900, 1999 to 2000, thereby the turn is 1900 and 2000 respectively in this instance.


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 26 mins (2005-01-02 06:59:52 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Correction -- \"from\" (not \"to\") one cetury to another

humbird
Native speaker of: Native in JapaneseJapanese, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

43 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +3
Context


Explanation:
The expression can also be used rather vaguely meaning several year around that time. So I would say you have to go by context. This is confirmed by my first Google hit "The Touring Turn-of-the-Century America: Photographs from the Detroit Publishing Company, 1880 - 1920, collection contains 25000 photographs of turn-of-the-century ...
memory.loc.gov/ammem/detroit/dethome.html"

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs 25 mins (2005-01-02 08:59:13 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

In response to your note on forward or backward, my feelings as a native speaker are to vaguely look forward, although I find absolutely nothing wrong with how the Detroit Publ. Co. use it either.
If you asked me for a spontaneous sentence using turn of the cent. I would say: \"My grandparents came to America at the t-of-the-c.\" and I would mean around 1905.
Context, context, context - and as to your question, circa or around 1900, 2000, etc. would be essentially the same time span.
Thanks for interesting question.

lindaellen (X)
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 20

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Krisztina Lelik
1 hr

agree  Laurel Porter (X): Hamo, I think it's the transition that's important, not the particular century in question. The Q. "Yes, but the turn of WHICH century?" is fairly irrelevant, unless one's confused as to 18th-19th v. 19th-20th or similar. HTH!
2 hrs

agree  Alexandra Tussing
1 day 22 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +5
turn of the century that just ended


Explanation:
My understanding is that when you say "turn of the 20th century", you are talking about the end of the 20th century/ beginning of the 21st century. I don't think it depends on context - I believe this is the correct usage. If you make a search on the internet for "turn of the 19th century", you will find sites that talk about the late 19th/ early 20th century, not the late 18th/early 19th century.

It's like when you refer to a page of a book you are turning. Turning page 5 ("the turn of page 5" so to speak) would mean that you're going over to page 6. Otherwise, it would be "Turning TO page 5".

Hope that answers your question.

Nesrin
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:48
Native speaker of: Arabic
PRO pts in category: 80
Grading comment
If all answers to mine and others' questions were like your answers to this one, I would be extremely pleased.

Acknowledgments: I would like to thank Nesrin for rendering clear my question to those who were confused about it. I would also like to thank Linda and Laurel for stressing the importance of duration. Please allow me to express my gratitude to cyrus-abd and our fellow contributor Dusty for their reaffirmation of Nesrin's contribution. Indeed, the expression in question does appear to indicate the end of the "out-going" and beginning of the in-coming centuries. Juvera's comment with regard to the use of the term in the absence of specific mention of a century is also greatly appreciated. Jonathan's contribution in this regard and his additional comment with regard to the term's adjectival use were, of course, very helpful. Thanks also go to Peter, Joergen, importal, and others for their supporting evidence. Finally, and certainly not least, my very best wishes to Humbird for getting everything off to a confusing start and thus provoking interesting dialogue -- Happy Hazuhinode!

With these acknowledgments I wish you and most other ProZians a very Happy New Year! That we continue to turn the page of each day with a better understanding of each other's languages and cultures.

Hamo in Hong Kong
January 2005

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Peter Linton (X)
26 mins

agree  Tony M: I think you understood friend Hamo's question better than I! Yes, indeed, I think it refers to the OUT-going century, as in 'turning the page on a bad episode in ones life'...
4 hrs

agree  juvera: If you don't say, which century, then it is the last one turning into this. Otherwise it has to be specified, like Nasrin said, say: turn of the 19th century (into the 20th). Dusty is right, it is a period of both sides of the respective centuries.
5 hrs

agree  Asghar Bhatti
8 hrs

agree  Jörgen Slet
3 days 4 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
See comment below...


Explanation:
As I understand this term, and as I have always interpreted it in my reading, it specifically means 'a small number of years spanning BOTH of these centuries' --- a rather vague period between 'late-19th-century' and 'early-20th-century', for example.

I always picture it as being that glimpse of both sides of the leaf you get when you 'turn the page' of a book; I think it so specifically refers to a transition period, one cannot even attempt to make it forward- or backward-looking. It seems to me to sum up 'the status quo at the time the century changed', with the implication that a new century might or might not have been expected to change that status quo!

All good wishes at this 'turn of the year'! :-)

Tony M
France
Local time: 21:48
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 260

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Peter Linton (X): Transition period makes sense
20 mins
  -> Thanks a lot Peter! In fact, I seem to have misinterpreted the question, and I believe Nesrin has the right idea here...

agree  Jörgen Slet: Added: well, yes, but yours made it clearer that it's a fairly long period spanning both centuries :)
3 days 3 hrs
  -> Thanks, Jörgen! In fact, I believe Nesrin has better understood what Hamo was getting at...
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5 peer agreement (net): +1
end of 19th/beginning of 20th century


Explanation:
is what "turn of the century" means when used as an adjective, e.g. turn-of-the-century mores.
Otherwise, describes period between any two centuries as indicated in context.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs 37 mins (2005-01-02 10:10:36 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Webster says \"The period from about 1890 to 1910\"

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs 39 mins (2005-01-02 10:12:30 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

\"turn of the century politics\" gets nearly 50 googles, all having to do with the 1890 to 1910 period.

Jonathan MacKerron
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 80

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  mportal: but I wonder how many of the google references were written before 2000. To me it usually means the last time the century changed, unless specified otherwise, in which case you could say eg turn of the 18th to 19th century, if that was what you meant
1 day 1 hr
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

4 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
entering into a new century and end of the other


Explanation:
but most of the time we take it as the end of the century

Kourosh Abdi
Türkiye
Local time: 23:48
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in KurdishKurdish, Native in Persian (Farsi)Persian (Farsi)

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  karina_douny: I approve of it
23 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)



Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.

You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs (or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.

KudoZ™ translation help

The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.


See also:
Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search