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喧々諤々

English translation: debate/discuss heatedly - (misused term)

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Japanese term or phrase:喧々諤々
English translation:debate/discuss heatedly - (misused term)
Entered by: tappi_k

15:50 Nov 4, 2004
Japanese to English translations [PRO]
General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters / Other
Japanese term or phrase: 喧々諤々
、課税対象者だけでなく税制の専門家から喧々諤々の議論が起こったとき....
I am trying to figure out the nuance of 喧々諤々 but having trouble finding in a dictionary. Thanks.
Kurt Hammond
United States
Local time: 04:35
attention - see my explanation
Explanation:
I think what the sentence is trying to depict is well explained by other answerers - that the argument is heated and people are speaking noisily. However, please note that the term 喧々諤々 does not exist (the reason why you could not find this in a dictionary, I imagine!). although people very often make a mistake of saying/writing this. what it is, is that there are two separate compound words which sound similar to one another and both of which describe particular manner in which people speak/discuss/argue (although meanings slightly differ from one to another); 喧々囂々（けんけんごうごう　ken-ken-gou-gou) and 侃々諤々（かんかんがくがく　kan-kan-gaku-gaku). the two get confused in many's speach and become 喧々諤々, which etymologically cannot signify anything. So you could translate it as others suggested but then in that case you should know that it actually isn't and cannot be entirely correct.

Selected response from:

tappi_k
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:35
Grading comment
Your explanation is most clear and also the explanation of why I could not find this term is also helpful. FYI the term I chose was "heated debate".
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
5 +1hotly debated, heated argument
humbird
5 +1attention - see my explanation
tappi_k
5clamorous
SenQ
5pandemonium (of discussion)
Nobuo Kawamura


Discussion entries: 1





  

Answers


15 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
喧々諤々
clamorous


Explanation:
喧喧諤諤=喧喧囂囂 means clamorous

SenQ
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
喧々諤々
hotly debated, heated argument


Explanation:
Both 喧々and 諤々describe the way people hotly and noisily argue


humbird
Native speaker of: Native in JapaneseJapanese, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 40

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Kaori Myatt
3 hrs
  -> Thank you Kaori-san.
neutral  tappi_k: fyi., 态Xdoesn't have a connotation of argument, it describes the way people express their opinion freely.
6 hrs
  -> Sir I'm afraid you are wrong. In Japan when bunch of people boisterously spit out their opinions it is more argument than debate. I said "hotly debated" in hope Japanese learn Western logic of debating. So far I don't see much sign of it.
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7 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
pandemonium (of discussion)


Explanation:
(alternatively) pandemonium of uproar (In this case it is too noisy to hear what they are saying)

Nobuo Kawamura
Japan
Local time: 20:35
Native speaker of: Native in JapaneseJapanese
PRO pts in category: 4
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8 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
喧々諤々
attention - see my explanation


Explanation:
I think what the sentence is trying to depict is well explained by other answerers - that the argument is heated and people are speaking noisily. However, please note that the term 喧々諤々 does not exist (the reason why you could not find this in a dictionary, I imagine!). although people very often make a mistake of saying/writing this. what it is, is that there are two separate compound words which sound similar to one another and both of which describe particular manner in which people speak/discuss/argue (although meanings slightly differ from one to another); 喧々囂々（けんけんごうごう　ken-ken-gou-gou) and 侃々諤々（かんかんがくがく　kan-kan-gaku-gaku). the two get confused in many's speach and become 喧々諤々, which etymologically cannot signify anything. So you could translate it as others suggested but then in that case you should know that it actually isn't and cannot be entirely correct.




    Reference: http://www.biwa.ne.jp/�`take-c/nihongo/thema%201/kenkengakug...
    Reference: http://www.big.or.jp/�`roadist/gy10.htm
tappi_k
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:35
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in JapaneseJapanese, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8
Grading comment
Your explanation is most clear and also the explanation of why I could not find this term is also helpful. FYI the term I chose was "heated debate".

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Peishun CHIANG: That's right. This mistake is specified here & there but still exists. and seems never ends.
2 hrs
  -> thanks for your comment - I know that languages change according to the way it's used in the society, but still this one is just wrong because it doesn't make any sense, and I thought it needed to be pointed out.
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