moyenne couronne

English translation: the middle ring

14:42 Apr 29, 2020
French to English translations [PRO]
Tech/Engineering - Transport / Transportation / Shipping
French term or phrase: moyenne couronne
Les tracés de la Grande Rocade Est et du Plateau de Saclay, situés en moyenne couronne, sont homogènes en termes de déplacements : la variation de la capacité entre les heures de pointe et les heures creuses nécessite de mettre en place un métro automatique à capacité adaptée.

I have found "inner suburb" for petite couronne and "outer suburb" for outer suburb but I can't find the equivalent for moyenne couronne.
Mohammed EL HALLOUBI
Local time: 09:49
English translation:the middle ring
Explanation:
"couronne" = a ring / donut shaped territory / suburbs that surrounds central Paris

moyenne couronne = one of the concentric "rings", the one that is in-between the "inner ring" (close to / next to Central Paris) and the "outer ring"


[la Grande Rocade Est et du Plateau de Saclay], situés en moyenne couronne
=
..., located in the middle ring of Paris' suburbs

Selected response from:

Daryo
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:49
Grading comment
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
5 +1middle-ring suburbs
Yvonne Gallagher
5mid suburbs / mid-suburbs
Douglas Galloway
4 +1the middle ring
Daryo
2 +2middle suburb
Marco Solinas
4further afield from the inner suburbs
Michael Grabczan-Grabowski
3middle-belt suburbs
SafeTex
3 -1peripheral central suburbs
Chris Pr
3 -3the middle/central range
Juan Arturo Blackmore Zerón
4 -6mean crown
Francois Boye
Summary of reference entries provided
article on transport in Paris
polyglot45

Discussion entries: 12





  

Answers


13 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5 peer agreement (net): +2
middle suburb


Explanation:
See https://books.google.ca/books?id=xqeB3zBd5ygC&pg=PA193&lpg=P... for an example.
Please note the low confidence.

Marco Solinas
Local time: 01:49
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in ItalianItalian
PRO pts in category: 16

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Tony M: This could work, but depends on Asker's context — in particular, if it mentions inner / middle / outer. Note, too, that the 'couronne' would be 'suburbs' — in the singular, it would be more 'faubourg' or 'un banlieue'
51 mins

agree  philgoddard
2 hrs

disagree  Francois Boye: middle is not moyen
11 hrs

neutral  Daryo: "middle ring" makes more sense to me // you can not really omit "ring".
18 hrs

agree  Yvonne Gallagher: Just add "ring"
1 day 7 hrs
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19 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -3
the middle/central range


Explanation:
The routes of the Grande Rocade Est and the Plateau de Saclay, located in the middle ring, are homogeneous in terms of travel.

https://www.britannica.com/place/Middle-Rocky-Mountains


Juan Arturo Blackmore Zerón
Mexico
Local time: 03:49
Native speaker of: Spanish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Tony M: While 'ring' might be usable, neither 'central' nor 'range' could work here.
42 mins

neutral  philgoddard: Rocade, not Rockies!
3 hrs

disagree  Yvonne Gallagher: you haven't read the context
5 hrs

disagree  Daryo: with your answers and "reference" [Rocky-Mountains around Paris?] OTOH "the middle ring" is fine.
18 hrs
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
further afield from the inner suburbs


Explanation:
In English, the term "inner suburbs" encompasses both "petite couronne" and "moyenne couronne." A distinction isn't normally made.

If you have to distinguish between "inner," "medium," and "outer" suburbs, you could consider rephrasing it like this:

"The routes of the Grande Rocade Est and the Plateau de Saclay, located further afield from the inner suburbs, are similar in terms of travel..."


Michael Grabczan-Grabowski
Canada
Local time: 02:49
Works in field
Native speaker of: English

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Tony M: I think this is unbearably clumsy, rather fuzzy and colloquial, and doesn't admit any possibility of having 3 rings, which could well be the essence of the document here.
12 mins
  -> True. It depends on the rest of the document and how important it is to make the distinctions. Given the example above, I thought it worked all right. :-)

neutral  Yvonne Gallagher: rather convoluted. inner, middle, and outer ring suburbs seems to be what's needed
4 hrs
  -> That's fair. If inner, middle, and outer ring suburbs are differentiated and referred to throughout the text, then I would use your suggestion.

neutral  Daryo: unnecessarily complicated + it could be interpreted to also apply to the "outer" ring
17 hrs
  -> True. Thanks for the feedback, Daryo.
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24 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): -6
mean crown


Explanation:
une couronne est circulaire; donc on peut la diviser en deux

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Note added at 4 hrs (2020-04-29 18:52:40 GMT)
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https://langloishg.fr/2013/03/27/un-territoire-de-linnovatio...

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Note added at 4 hrs (2020-04-29 19:21:26 GMT)
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crown = courbure in mathematics (see the attachment)

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Note added at 4 hrs (2020-04-29 19:24:35 GMT)
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crown = curvature in English (see the attachment)

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Note added at 6 hrs (2020-04-29 20:51:02 GMT)
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_curve

Francois Boye
United States
Local time: 04:49
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Tony M: Meaningless in Asker's context of public transportation / This is nothing about geometry! We're talking more about town planning! These are descriptions of the 'zones' of Paris.
37 mins
  -> Geometry is indeed relevant to how roads are designed!// https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_curve

disagree  Yvonne Gallagher: makes no sense here
5 hrs
  -> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_curve

disagree  Daryo: BOTH "moyenne" AND "couronne" misinterpreted / wrong meaning presumed !!! Only possible result: nonsense that fits in the ST like a square peg in a round hole.
17 hrs

disagree  Douglas Galloway: Nothing to do with geometry here
17 hrs

disagree  awilliams: This doesn't make sense - this isn't talking about curvature or geometry.
17 hrs

disagree  SafeTex: Nonsensical in English
3 days 6 hrs
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18 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
peripheral central suburbs


Explanation:
...or even "outermost central suburbs"...

...might be options...

Chris Pr
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:49
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Daryo: ?? I'm acutely aware that the logic of human language is not exactly the same logic as in maths, still: how can anything be "peripheral" AND "central" at the same time in any language?? I get it, it's from the Humpty Dumpty school of linguistics!
4 mins
  -> And I'm "accutely' aware of how native English actually works....
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18 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
mid suburbs / mid-suburbs


Explanation:
A bit more natural-sounding than middle suburb

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Note added at 18 hrs (2020-04-30 09:22:23 GMT)
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Depends on the context

Example sentence(s):
  • Ref 1: Darwin Mid Suburbs Needs Assessment
  • Ref 2: Anywhere out of the mid-suburbs and public transport becomes loss making.

    https://nt.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0007/362689/darwin-mid-suburbs-needs-assessment.pdf
    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/sep/03/new-economic-thinking-could-help-tackle-planetary-as-well-as-housing-crises
Douglas Galloway
France
Local time: 09:49
Native speaker of: English

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  writeaway: are you really 100% sure this is the ONLY possible correct answer? That's what CL 5 indicates
1 hr

neutral  ph-b (X): @w/a: all CL5 indicates is that the answerer is certain of his answer, not that it is the only possible answer.
2 hrs
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18 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
the middle ring


Explanation:
"couronne" = a ring / donut shaped territory / suburbs that surrounds central Paris

moyenne couronne = one of the concentric "rings", the one that is in-between the "inner ring" (close to / next to Central Paris) and the "outer ring"


[la Grande Rocade Est et du Plateau de Saclay], situés en moyenne couronne
=
..., located in the middle ring of Paris' suburbs



Daryo
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:49
Native speaker of: Native in SerbianSerbian, Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 34

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Tony M
1 hr
  -> Thanks!

agree  writeaway: this makes me think they are indeed talking about a route, not an area: a variation de la capacité entre les heures de pointe et les heures creuses nécessite de mettre en place un métro automatique à capacité adaptée
1 hr
  -> it could equally apply to some "ring road" (or "circle line") as well as to a ring-shaped territory. I think that here "moyenne couronne" is the territory where this metro line is located. Thanks!

agree  ph-b (X): The best answer so far.
2 hrs
  -> Merci!

agree  Michael Grabczan-Grabowski: Perhaps, in the original poster's translation, he could substantiate a little further for a lay person by writing "the middle ring of suburbs."
6 hrs
  -> Yes. Thanks!

disagree  Francois Boye: THe text does not refer to Paris. 'Middle" is not the English for 'moyenne'mean
12 hrs
  -> it takes only few seconds - if you ask Google the right question - to find the whole ST published online and waiting to be picked up **and read**: http://www.scmsa.eu/archives/SCM_Metro_Grand_Paris_2011_06_2... // take a look at the page 2 ..

disagree  Chris Pr: The term "ring" all alone has no geographical, planning or topographical meaning whatsoever....maybe "donut" would have been the better choice...?
20 hrs
  -> If someone told me that one day I would be reading such nonsense, I wouldn't have believed it.

disagree  Yvonne Gallagher: with the comment by Chris above. Absolutely senseless
8 days
  -> Interesting use of "senseless" - OTOH even by reading them backwards or upside down I couldn't make any sense of your comments ...
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1 day 20 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
middle-ring suburbs


Explanation:
This seems to be the best way of phrasing this in English, differentiating between the inner-, middle-, and outer- ring suburbs

All other answers seem to be missing a crucial word, so I finally decided to post this.

situés en moyenne couronne

located in the middle-ring suburbs.

As already noted , it's usually plural "suburbS" in English. Yes, we can talk (very rarely) of "a suburb" but in this type of context it would be plural (and there are 2 mentioned after all).

https://www.corelogic.com.au/news/where-are-the-affordable-m...

While the middle-ring suburbs may not be as desirable to some as inner-city suburbs, they still tend to be much better catered for with amenity than suburbs located further from the city centre.

The middle-ring suburbs, which we are classifying as being between 10 and 20km from the city centre, typically offer more affordable housing than the inner–city suburbs.

Yvonne Gallagher
Ireland
Local time: 08:49
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 25

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Tony M
26 mins
  -> Thank you!
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3 days 7 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
middle-belt suburbs


Explanation:
Hello
I've entered this as no one has used "belt" yet it is a contender without saying it is the only solution.
All hits though seem to be from Australia


    https://www.infilledmonton.com/research-and-articles-publishing/tag/Morphology
    https://canhedance.wordpress.com/2013/05/31/indebted-once-more/
SafeTex
France
Local time: 09:49
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 52
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Reference comments


18 hrs
Reference: article on transport in Paris

Reference information:
https://halshs.archives-ouvertes.fr/halshs-01527513/document

The author uses "inner suburbs, outer suburbs and central suburbs".
Some of the English is a bit odd so use with care

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Note added at 19 hrs (2020-04-30 10:16:40 GMT)
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I mentioned this because it could be that in some circles, this termoinology is in regular use

polyglot45
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 204

Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
neutral  Daryo: "central suburbs" sounds weird (to put it mildly) I would include that in the category "Some of the English is a bit odd" // a territory encased in-between two concentrical rings is hardly "central", at least not as "central" is usually understood. // yes
10 mins
  -> I think you mean "weird" don't you?
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