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German to English translations [PRO] Tech/Engineering - Electronics / Elect Eng / Elektroinstallation
German term or phrase:Würgenippel
***Würgenippel***
geschlossene Ausführung aus Polyethylen, IP 54 • einfache Kabeldurchführung mit durchstoßbarer Membran • einfache Montage durch großflächigen Sechskant
"Not all what sounds good exists." Although your English is painfully un-English, D.I. Virrelli makes a pretty good argument that no exact equivalent of the source term seems to exist in English. So the best we can do is seek a term that comes as close as possible to the source object.
I identified the manufacturer and found the corresponding homepage: http://www.kroll.de/produkte/warmlufterzeugung/mobile-warmlu... (I obviously mismatched Google links due to the mass of references I added, and could not distinguish the manufacturer as the google link pointed to 2 pages only. Now I have to admit, that it refers to a German manufacturer)
Johannes Gleim, the Asker must have made that choice while I was posting, but it didn't update on my screen until I manually refreshed.
Anyway, the choice made — and supported by several contributors — will reinforce the (imperfect) status quo, making it even harder for future translators to choose anything else.
In line with an idea I raised already a few times, I have just found that two sites translate "Würgenippel"/"Würgestopfen" of the same variety as described in the source text as "... plug ...". I agree that "plug" on its own isn't sufficient.
"Würgestopfen WST M20/sw Artikelnummer: 20302001 Würgestopfen M_ x 1,5 mm mit geschlossener Dichtungsmembran, Polyethylen" https://www.spelsberg.de/nc/produkt/an/20302001/ "Twist plug WST M20/sw Article number: 20302001 Twist plug M_ x 1.5 mm with closed sealing membrane, polyethylene"
I cannot find the indicated text on the link posted, and it is only possible to search the site by part number. If relevant, please repost as a direct link (without the Google prefix), after confirming the page number by visiting the site (may have changed since Google indexed it), and include also the part number.
If more clarity is desired, it could be achieved with something like: "Cable gland (Würgenippel)" or "Specialised cable gland (Würgenippel)".
I realise that typical cable glands don't look like a "Würgenippel". But I feel that they still fit my loose definition of a cable gland: threaded widget used to provide a seal (and protect cables too) when running cables through a cabinet or similar. Is my loose definition of "cable gland" wrong somehow? Does a "Würgenippel" not also fit into that definition? I can see that the "Würgenippel" has a different mechanism for sealing, different shape, and different material from common cable glands. But maybe that just makes it a special-purpose cable gland.
If you had complete freedom, unburdened by past translations of "Würgenippel", what translation would you then propose?
_____ P.S. I just noticed that Würth also has a questionable translation of "Kontermutter" as "counter nut" (instead of, say, "jam nut"). [Ironically, in German Würth actually use "Gegenmutter".]
At least "self-sealing grommet" is less difficult to discover the intended meaning of by searching online, without the risk of bringing up explicit images. Nevertheless, I do think "grommet" may be misleading to the casual reader (despite expertise in the field).
If we have the freedom to deviate from previous translations, rather than be captive to that legacy, we might find some way to improve upon them.
I would then suggest that something like "self-sealing threaded grommet" is worth considering.
"Cable gland" I think is not a translation of "Würgenippel" at all, but rather a translation of the category to which "Würgenippel" might be considered to belong. This is a disadvantage insofar as precision is lost; and there is perhaps some debate about the suitability of such a categorisation. However, in the source text a specification immediately follows, which restores the precision element.
You are totally right. The "Einführungsstutzen" is a "Würgenippel" in fact, and a grommet is never threaded.
I think it's useless to continue this discussion as the asker selected again the answer with most agree, presumably not taking into account the discussion. Sorry, I can't help if arguments are ignored or negated.
"Self-sealing grommet" I think was not an ideal choice (in the past, and also now) either, because - a "grommet" typically looks like a rubber eyelet, and they are almost never threaded — I found a few examples with internal thread, but none with external thread (cf.https://jamminsam.com/vintage-style-threaded-eyelets/ ).
As per my earlier post entitled "Würgenippel" images, it seems that even among German-speakers there's not totally consistent usage of "Würgenippel". Although occasionally/rarely the term is applied to objects that do look like grommets, as in https://www.elektro4000.de/Kabel-Leitungen/Einfuehrungssyste... , I don't think that applies to the source text, which mentions "geschlossene Ausführung".
"Twist nipple" I think was an unfortunate choice (in the past, and also now), because - the meaning is not at all intuitive (to English-speakers); and - even when searching in good faith, it is difficult to discover the intended meaning, and more likely to come across sexually explicit content.
By the way, I hadn't realised at all that, "The cable can only be introduced by twisting rather than by pushing straight ahead." Are you saying that you think that's where the moniker "twist" came from?? I had presumed it was a reference to the thread — hence I would have preferred "threaded nipple" instead of "twist nipple".
Anyway, if we have the freedom to deviate from previous translations, rather than be captive to that legacy, we might find some way to improve upon them.
My view is that there's no perfect translation for this item. It seems to be an object that's almost exclusively used in Germany, with a little use in other continental European countries. Has anybody found examples of use either in the UK/Ireland or outside Europe??
If it's not even used in English-speaking countries, then there's simply no existing native word/phrase for it. [Whatever translation may ultimately be adopted, there's an argument in favour of appending the verbatim German name (in italics) for clarity.]
I also believe that some 'imperfect' translations that were coined in the past (as neologisms) were subsequently adopted/borrowed by other translators, and so propagated to the point that continuing to use those 'imperfect' translations can be justified purely because of this legacy.
Genau so sieht ein Würgenippel aus, aus Plastik, mit Gewinde zum Einschrauben und einem vorgeprägtem "knock-out"-Deckel zum Ausbrechen. Das Kabel sollte einen größeren Durchmesser als das entstehende Loch haben, damit sich die Deckellippen anlegen und möglichst viele Umwelteinflüsse abhalten (auch wenn das keine hermetische Abdichtung ist). Das Kabel muss daher durch Drehbewegungen "hineingewürgt" werden.
Yes, it doesn't look like a grommet either, so I dunno.
While I trust Cilian's judgment (see the old ProZ Q), he wasn't really that sure what to call it. You need to look at the d-box. I don't know why ProZ is concealing the poster's profile, but Cilian later said: "I think it's sth. like a tight-fitting eyelet or sleeve through which a cable is passed and which keeps out dust/air/moisture."
I may have missed it but did anyone send a photo? - that could clarify whether it is cable gland (my assumption due to the hex head and thread) or indeed a twist nipple or even something that is generally called a self sealing grommet (whether the term is correct or not) these days . The proof is in the design/function principle pudding. :)))
A plug is a "Blindflansch", "Stöpfsel" or "Stecker". A "Blindflansch" covers a hole in a junction box or cubicle wall, provided for cable entries (twist nipples or glands).
A grommet is a "Tülle" or "Durchführungshülse". I covers sharp edges of holes in partition walls and protect internal wirings against abrasion (and breakdown).
The shallow circle in the middle of a twist nipple is the knockout for insertig a cable through the hole. If you look precisely you will recognize the thread pitch
A cable gland is a "Kabelverschraubung". It contains a gasket seal (Pressdichtung), which seals the entry against dust, humidity and gasses and serves as strain relief (Zugentlastung). The most reliable type for cable entries.
A non-armoured gland is the same as a cable gland, except for the material (plastic instead of metal). It's no "Würgenippel".
The last item (the first posted in your series) is no electrical part, but connects pipes and tubes for water or other media.
You may still need an explanation for the term "Würgenippel". The interior diameter of the hole is less than the cable diameter. The cable can only be introduced by twisting rather than by pushing straight ahead.
As mentioned, I was suggesting that the word "plugs" could potentially be combined with other words to form a phrase indicating that there is a (self-sealing) hole for cables to pass through — "with cable pass-through".
However, sometimes a "Würgenippel" has no hole! So maybe I should have said "with cable pass-through option"?
I also found "stopping plugs" (or "screw plugs" or "threaded plugs") look somewhat similar to one variety of "Würgenippel" — except that they don't have any facility for passing cables through them. Maybe there is some suitable phrase that can incorporate those terms, such as *"stopping plug with cable pass-through"?
I don't want to propose any neologisms, but on the topic of "nipple" I would be open to considering other variants that could be proposed (by others, not me). The sort of thing I'm thinking of is as follows. "threaded nipple" (this exists, but not quite a "Würgenippel") "self-sealing nipple" (cf. https://www.oeg.net/en/eurocone-nipple-1-2-self-sealing-with... ) "cable nipple" (this also exists, but definitely not a "Würgenippel") *"self-sealing threaded nipple for cables" (not an established phrase, but perhaps a definition) Unfortunately none of these quite fit the bill. The last may be acceptable as an explanation, but couldn't be claimed as a synonym.
is not the benchmark. You cannot pick only one translated (!) homepage, and neglect all dictionaries, reliable references, and other homepages, icluding that of the inventor.
Again, grommet is a different article for a different purpose and the intended for sealing. This is a task for glands and twist nipples (latter if adjusted to the cable diameter). A grommet is used inside a cubicle, where sealing is of minor importance and where sever wirings are passed through.
Thefastshow is on the right track! I cite "Grommet( see wiki) is defo the wrong term, technically it is a different product from the one in question.This product may contain a grommet, but in this instance does not.This is a cable gland or (twist) nipple with a hex head & thread". Thank you!
BTW: thefastshow posted while I was composing my previous post, so we both found those two links to Würth independently.
~~~
EDIT: The Würth website also has translations in several other languages, which might provide further inspiration. "Retour > Catégories produits > Installation électrique > Pose de câbles et conduits électriques > Presse-étoupe métrique > Embout hélicoïdal, métrique > Embout hélicoïdal, métrique PE-LD" "Presse-étoupe auto-obturant, polyéthylène" https://eshop.wuerth.de/Product-categories/Twist-nipple-metr...
In the case of "twist nipple", the phrase does not appear to have been widely adopted in English in the relevant context, in which case the intended meaning probably would not be conveyed to the target audience.
Using the word "nipple" is not a problem, but the complete phrase needs to be sufficiently well known among the target readership.
In defence of Johannes: This thing here kind of shows some resemblance to the part of the body and the Würth company classifies the specific design as twist nipple: https://eshop.wuerth.de/Self-sealing-cable-grommet-polyethyl... This is not to say though that there may not be better translation around.
"No technical will invite such comparisons... There is no such statement you alleging!" It is difficult to take seriously any translation into English from a contributor with such an imperfect grasp of the target language.
I didn't know that meaning for XXX. In fact "nipple" has also non-technical significations. But consider the following Wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nipple_(disambiguation) You will see that all pages are technical, except for 2 human-related (anatomy and baby bottle) and 2 albums, remainder is 5 technical articles.
And if goes without saying that "twist nipple" is understood only in the context. Nobody will assume anything like XXX.
I'm sorry Johannes, but I actually did. XXX sites is another word for porn sites; I didn't want to make it so obvious. In any case, I don't think the asker is into that kinky stuff.
Chris did post a link to an old ProZ Q, where you can see that the English word seems to have little to do with the German. There might be another word than grommet, but I'm not sure, so I'm not going to agree anywhere.
not Björn either. There is no such statement you alleging! Please adhere to the subject!
While you are are still confusing grommets and twist nipples, I checked the term "grommet" and provided serious information about kind and use of grommets, including the etymologic sources. As this exceeds the available place in the discussion box I had to add it to my proposal.
Note: As electrical engineer and former electrician I remember very well the differences between grommet, twist nipple and cable gland. I worked with all such types of cable entries and bushings during all of my professional activities.
from the grommet illustration that these wiring harnesses will not seal, have no thread as required and do not comply to the specification for "Würgenippel".
thank you for confirming my statements. but please note that "Würgenippel" are not "self-sealing" per se and that the inventor named it "twist nipple", a well common term for electricians.
Mag zwar so ähnlich aussehen, ist aber nicht dasselbe. Wesentlich ist die Tatsache, dass ein Würgenippel nicht in ein Loch eingesteckt, sondern eingeschraubt wird. Grommets werden üblicherweise nur innerhalb von Schaltkästen verwendet. Dort werden sie zum Durchführen von Einzeladern oder Kabel verwendet und müssen nicht luftdicht abschließen, wie es bei Durchführungen nach außen sein sollte.
Als Grommet (vom französischen gromette, Kandare am Zaumzeug) bezeichnet man einen Ring oder eine Tülle, die man durch Löcher in Materialien steckt, um diese beispielsweise zu verstärken, zu schützen oder abzudichten. Meist sind sie aus Gummi oder Metall. Durch Grommets können zwei Komponenten voneinander entkoppelt werden, z. B. zwischen einem Mikrofon und dem Stativ, um den Gehäuseschall zu dämpfen. Beim Skateboard werden Grommets eingesetzt, um die Achsen lenkbar zu machen. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grommet