pognassent

English translation: maneuvers the numbers........cook the books/numbers

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:pognassent
English translation:maneuvers the numbers........cook the books/numbers
Entered by: Verginia Ophof

00:29 May 8, 2015
French to English translations [PRO]
Business/Commerce (general)
French term or phrase: pognassent
This is a Canadian French term that I'm not quite able to grasp the meaning of. Any French Canadian experts here?

______________________

au niveau des ventes, des objectifs peu réalisables, flous ( les données changent trop souvent), le Plan Boni des ventes est diminuée à toutes les années. Quand ce n'est pas les comptables qui pognasssent les chiffres, ce sont les objectifs qui nous sont descendus qui n'ont pas de sens. Au niveau de ma rémunération pour l'année 2014, il y a eut un écart de 27,428 $ entre la cible et le réel et cela devrait être pire pour 2015. Ce n'est pas très encourageant. Le travail des vendeurs est rendu tellement complexe maintenant (relation client, interaction avec tous les intervenants internes, la gouvernance (charge administrative)) que la rémunération s'y rattachant ne reflète pas la réalité du marché. Aussi, il y a eut trop de coupures de personnel dans les groupes gravitant autour de ventes et par ricochet les clients, les ventes sont rendu débordées, non pas dans le sens de relation client mais plutôt comme homme/femme orchestre. C'est rendu qu'il faut tout faire, la compagnie nous impose un énorme charge administrative, nous sommes plus souvent qu'autrement laissé à nous même et ce, avec peu de reconnaissance
Audra deFalco (X)
United States
Local time: 09:08
maneuvers the numbers........cook the books/numbers
Explanation:
suggestion
Selected response from:

Verginia Ophof
Belize
Local time: 07:08
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +3maneuvers the numbers........cook the books/numbers
Verginia Ophof
4 +2accountants messing with our sales figures
Daryo
3 +2manipulate
Charles Davis
4who fiddle
Peter LEGUIE
1doctoring (the figures / data / statistics)
andres-larsen
Summary of reference entries provided
pognasser, poignasser
andres-larsen

Discussion entries: 20





  

Answers


1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
manipulate


Explanation:
Pognasser is a variant of poignasser, which, in Quebec, means taponner.
http://encyclopedie_universelle.fracademic.com/180448/pognas...

Taponner is another Quebec word, meaning "Tâter (qqch), le manipuler sans réelle nécessité"
http://encyclopedie_universelle.fracademic.com/167434/taponn...

Interestingly, poignasser also appears as meaning "tripoter, manier" in Normandy.
http://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/poignasser

In other words, it seems to mean fiddle with or manipulate (literally).

So it "poignasser les chiffres" would seem to be a metaphorical use of the verb.

I would be very tempted to read it as "fiddle the figures", because I get the sense that this is quite colloquial, but I'm not entirely sure it means that. The question is whether it refers to false accounting or to creative accounting; "fiddle", to my mind, would mean "falsify", whereas it may well simply mean that the accountants manipulate true figures to create a certain impression. I'd be inclined to err on the side of caution and put "manipulate". But maybe a Canadian colleague will tell us that it implies straight falsification, in which case "fiddle the figures" would be a good translation.

Charles Davis
Spain
Local time: 14:08
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 36
Notes to answerer
Asker: Yes--using US English. I think "cook the books" is much more common in US English.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: Agree with "fiddle the figures, - the books". The original adopts familiar language here and there but the register is otherwise quite formal.//I'd forgotten this was US context. Effectively, "fiddle" is very GB.
8 hrs
  -> Thanks for the comment, Nikki. As I've said, I'm not confident that it means fiddling, which is actually falsifying figures; it could be manipulating them without actually lying. I think meaning trumps register, and "manipulate" is safer.

agree  Sheri P: If it does imply falsification, and if Audra's writing for the US, I wouldn't use "fiddle the figures." The expression isn't really used in US EN. Acc to this ref, it's chiefly BR http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_eng...
10 hrs
  -> Thanks, Sheri :) I didn't realise it wasn't used in American English

agree  philgoddard: Several possible answers, but yours is the first and best referenced.
14 hrs
  -> Thanks, Phil :)
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +3
maneuvers the numbers........cook the books/numbers


Explanation:
suggestion

Example sentence(s):
  • maneuvers the numbers ...........companies who cooked the books...........learning these money-manipulation methods will keep you alert to companies who may be cooking the books
  • learning these money-manipulation methods will keep you alert to companies who may be cooking the books

    Reference: http://www.investopedia.com/articles/analyst/071502.asp
Verginia Ophof
Belize
Local time: 07:08
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 48
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  B D Finch: Agree with "cook the books", not with your first suggestion, which isn't the right register.
6 hrs
  -> Thank you B D Finch !

agree  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: "cook the books", anything US which suggests playing around with the figures!
9 hrs
  -> Th !ank you Nikki

agree  GILOU
1 day 5 hrs
  -> Thank you Gilou !!
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9 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
who fiddle


Explanation:
My reference is "fiddling the books" in UK English. I am fairly sure about the meaning, but it may sound too familiar.
We need the advice of some expert French Canadian professionals here!

Peter LEGUIE
Local time: 14:08
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 40
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22 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
les comptables qui pognasssent les chiffres
accountants messing with our sales figures


Explanation:
if you look at the whole of:

"au niveau des ventes, des objectifs peu réalisables, flous ( les données changent trop souvent), le Plan Boni des ventes est diminuée à toutes les années. Quand ce n'est pas les comptables qui pognasssent les chiffres, ce sont les objectifs qui nous sont descendus qui n'ont pas de sens. Au niveau de ma rémunération pour l'année 2014, il y a eut un écart de 27,428 $ entre la cible et le réel et cela devrait être pire pour 2015. Ce n'est pas très encourageant. Le travail des vendeurs est rendu tellement complexe maintenant (relation client, interaction avec tous les intervenants internes, la gouvernance (charge administrative)) que la rémunération s'y rattachant ne reflète pas la réalité du marché. Aussi, il y a eut trop de coupures de personnel dans les groupes gravitant autour de ventes et par ricochet les clients, les ventes sont rendu débordées, non pas dans le sens de relation client mais plutôt comme homme/femme orchestre. C'est rendu qu'il faut tout faire, la compagnie nous impose un énorme charge administrative, nous sommes plus souvent qu'autrement laissé à nous même et ce, avec peu de reconnaissance"

this is salesmen having a rant about their job being made more and more difficult, including the fact that the accounts department is wrongly recording their sales - they are not concerned with bean-counters "cooking the books" (i.e. showing profits for the whole company when there is none, or the opposite if required) they are only annoyed about how their own sales figures are being "roughed up" "badly handled" "given a bashing" ...IOW misrepresented.


Daryo
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:08
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in SerbianSerbian, Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 166

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Charles Davis: I think "mess with" or "mess around with" is a good option here; a colloquial way of saying manipulate, which I believe is the basic meaning. I'd leave it as "the figures"; you may be right, but in any case "the figures" is the natural way to say it (IMO)
7 hrs
  -> yes, it may be safer to just leave "the figures" - the likely audience will understand anyway, as anyone who has spent more than a half-hour with salesmen will know what they meant to say. Thanks!

agree  Germaine: with Charles: messing (around) with the figures
3 days 17 hrs
  -> Merci!
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1 day 11 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 1/5Answerer confidence 1/5
doctoring (the figures / data / statistics)


Explanation:
***Doctoring the figures*** - Herald Scotland
www.heraldscotland.com/.../doctoring-the-figures-the-boards...
Feb 21, 2013 - Doctoring the figures: The boards that failed patients ... Lothian ***that manipulated its waiting list figures to make them look better than they were***, ...

Hans Werner Sinn accuses Eurostat of doctoring the Greek ...
www.eurointelligence.com/.../hans-werner-sinn-accuses-euros...
May 9, 2014 - ... who says Eurostat had produced deliberately misleading figures for Greece ... continues with its politically motivated ***doctoring of the figures***.”.

Howard Fienberg: ***Doctoring the Data***, Nursing the News ...
www.hfienberg.com/clips/errors.htm
The New York Times compared this figure on December 1 "to having three jumbo jets filled with patients crash every two days." But among the discussions of ...

***Doctoring the Data*** - Hudson Institute
www.hudson.org/content/.../attachment/362/aeidoctorikng_the...
Economist the. Health Care. By Elizabeth McCaughey. The national debate over health care is so polarized that many people don't seem to care about the facts ...

Watchdog: Air Force ***'doctored the data'*** to make A-10 look ...
thehill.com/.../232202-watchdog-air-force-doctored-the-data-to-make-a-...
Feb 9, 2015 - “The Air Force cherry picked and doctored the data that it released in an attempt to build a false narrative against the A-10,” said Mandy ...

Does the term "doctoring" come from the fact that doctors are ...
www.quora.com › Health and Medicine › Medicine and Healthcare
Mar 18, 2011 - I think it's more to do with patching something up when it is sick. e.g. ***'Doctoring the statistics'*** would refer to taking some really 'unhealthy' ...

Crime down, says Greenslade as he denies statistics are ...
www.tribune242.com/.../crime-down-says-greenslade-he-denies...
Apr 17, 2013 - He rejected rumours that the police force was ***doctoring the statistics*** to make it appear as though crime has decreased when it is really on the ...

andres-larsen
Venezuela
Local time: 09:08
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8
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Reference comments


1 hr peer agreement (net): +1
Reference: pognasser, poignasser

Reference information:
Untitled Document
www.adelinc.qc.ca/lexique/p.asp
..... pognasser, poignasser : v. tr. et pr.
1. Saisir, manier maladroitement.
2. Se livrer à des attouchements que répudient les bonnes mœurs.
Tu sais, lorsqu'on veut s'pognasser, on s'pognasse pas sous l'nez d'son curé. (Suzanne Aubry, J'te l'parle mieux quand j'te l'écris)

andres-larsen
Venezuela
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
agree  Germaine: Le Delisle ajoute "tripoter" et "tripotage". "Tripoter les chiffres" = les falsifier, les trafiquer = tamper with
2 hrs
  -> merci
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