finish or graduate from (secondary school)

English translation: No: leave; not finish, not graduate

11:24 Apr 1, 2015
English language (monolingual) [PRO]
Education / Pedagogy / School Report
English term or phrase: finish or graduate from (secondary school)
My question is about using "graduate" for a secondary school-leavers.

At the end of the school year pupils receive certificates with their marks and other information, which are signed by their form master.

The summarising part of this document presents the decision taken by the Teachers Board to the effect that the pupil
a. is transferred to the next form (grade) or
b) leaves the school or
c) stays in this form for a second year.

So is it possible to use "graduate" in b) as an alternative to 'finish" or "leave".

All my dictionaries are unanimous that it isn't because "graduation" applies to higher education establishments. Some my colleagues, however, have another point of view.

The whole section would go like this:

Teachers Board decision: the pupil is to be transferred to the next grade, is to leave (or graduate from) the school, is to be awarded with Certificate of Achievement (commendation), is to be left for the re-course, etc.

Please note that we are talking about secondary school here.

Thank you in advance.
Sterk
Ukraine
Local time: 12:17
Selected answer:No: leave; not finish, not graduate
Explanation:
The use of "graduate" in this is a straightforward American/British English difference. In the US students do graduate from high school, as well as from university; in the UK and Ireland etc. they finish or complete secondary education and only graduate from university.

Your text, by the way, is clearly British (or at least not American): "form master" alone marks it as such.

But that is not what your text is about anyway. Graduate or finish refer to completing the whole sequence of secondary studies (and nearly always, if not always, refer to completing post-secondary education, that is, A-level in British terms). But that's not what's involved in your text. The fact that one of the options is to go on to the next form shows that this is about a decision being taken in the course of secondary education, before it has been completed. So graduating or finishing at this point is not an option.

Option (b) refers to the possibility of the student leaving the school before having completed the full course of study. So neither graduate nor leave would fit here.

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Note added at 23 mins (2015-04-01 11:48:40 GMT)
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If option (b) were implemented, at a point before finishing compulsory education, the student would have to be placed in another institution; he or she couldn't finish and leave education permanently at that point. If it were post-16, leaving the school could mean abandoning his or her education.

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Note added at 28 mins (2015-04-01 11:52:54 GMT)
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To put it simply, this is about what happens if a student passes or fails a year of secondary school study. If they pass, option (a) applies: they go on to the next year (form, grade). If they fail, either they have to leave the school (b) or repeat the year (c).

This is presumably about a private (non-state) school, which can require students who fail a year of study to leave.

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Note added at 1 hr (2015-04-01 12:42:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Please note that, as Sheila says, I meant to write "ne¡ther graduate nor FINISH would fit here"; "leave" does fit.
Selected response from:

Charles Davis
Spain
Local time: 11:17
Grading comment
Thank you very much.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



SUMMARY OF ALL EXPLANATIONS PROVIDED
4 +9No: leave; not finish, not graduate
Charles Davis
3leave or graduate
magdadh


Discussion entries: 3





  

Answers


7 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
leave or graduate


Explanation:
In the US students certainly seem to 'graduate' from High Schools: cf: http://www.forbes.com/pictures/fjle45hklm/10-high-paying-job...

And that terms is widely used in English materials referencing secondary school leavers in other countries.

It is NOT commonly used in the UK, where 'graduate' indeed implies completing a course of higher education and a degree.



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Note added at 31 mins (2015-04-01 11:55:57 GMT)
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An (important) note inspired by @Charles Davis 's answer:

'Graduate' implies successful completion. 'Leaving', in the situation in which there is an option of continuation suggests (unless I am reading it wrong) that the full course of secondary education is not completed, and thus, 'graduate' would not be appropriate here.

But if we are talking about let's say Year 2 students moving on to Year 3 vs being kept behind to repeat Year 2, and let's say Year 6 (final) students leaving/graduating vs being kept behind to repeat the year, then 'graduate' is possible UNLESS you are talking about a British system.

magdadh
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:17
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in PolishPolish
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

20 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +9
No: leave; not finish, not graduate


Explanation:
The use of "graduate" in this is a straightforward American/British English difference. In the US students do graduate from high school, as well as from university; in the UK and Ireland etc. they finish or complete secondary education and only graduate from university.

Your text, by the way, is clearly British (or at least not American): "form master" alone marks it as such.

But that is not what your text is about anyway. Graduate or finish refer to completing the whole sequence of secondary studies (and nearly always, if not always, refer to completing post-secondary education, that is, A-level in British terms). But that's not what's involved in your text. The fact that one of the options is to go on to the next form shows that this is about a decision being taken in the course of secondary education, before it has been completed. So graduating or finishing at this point is not an option.

Option (b) refers to the possibility of the student leaving the school before having completed the full course of study. So neither graduate nor leave would fit here.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 23 mins (2015-04-01 11:48:40 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

If option (b) were implemented, at a point before finishing compulsory education, the student would have to be placed in another institution; he or she couldn't finish and leave education permanently at that point. If it were post-16, leaving the school could mean abandoning his or her education.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 28 mins (2015-04-01 11:52:54 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

To put it simply, this is about what happens if a student passes or fails a year of secondary school study. If they pass, option (a) applies: they go on to the next year (form, grade). If they fail, either they have to leave the school (b) or repeat the year (c).

This is presumably about a private (non-state) school, which can require students who fail a year of study to leave.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2015-04-01 12:42:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Please note that, as Sheila says, I meant to write "ne¡ther graduate nor FINISH would fit here"; "leave" does fit.

Charles Davis
Spain
Local time: 11:17
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 48
Grading comment
Thank you very much.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  magdadh: I agree, if the text IS indeed about the British system, and if the option (b) indeed means leaving before completion. In any context, 'graduation' implies (successful) completion.
3 mins
  -> That's right. Thanks very much, magdadh!

agree  Sheila Wilson: "Leave the school" (as opposed to "leave school" which implies the end of school life). NB: (just to avoid confusion) I believe you meant to put "So neither graduate nor finish would fit here" ;)
25 mins
  -> Yes, thanks Sheila. Encroaching senility, I'm afraid :)

agree  katsy: exactly!
27 mins
  -> Thanks katsy :)

agree  Christine Andersen
29 mins
  -> Thanks, Christine :)

agree  Alok Tiwari
1 hr
  -> Thanks, Alok :)

agree  Veronika McLaren
1 hr
  -> Thanks, Veronika :)

agree  jccantrell: From the USA, I might suggest 'promoted to the next grade' (or the British equivalent) and we would say 'drop out' for those who leave without finishing. Pretty good explanation.
2 hrs
  -> Thanks, JC! I think the British expression would be "progress". "Form", by the way, is pretty old-fashioned in the UK these days and sounds a lot like a private school to me.

agree  Peter Simon
2 hrs
  -> Thanks, Peter!

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2562 days
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