stabilité au feu

English translation: fire stability

20:18 Oct 2, 2013
French to English translations [PRO]
Tech/Engineering - Transport / Transportation / Shipping / subway safety regulations
French term or phrase: stabilité au feu
The writer is not French and I assume his 'cul de sac' is actually a bottleneck.

I have seen the posted term confidently translated as 'fire stability' but seek confirmation from someone with more technical knowledge than myself.

Remarquons que dans le cas de sortie unique en position centrale, les deux culs-de-sac générés, de longueur inférieure par rapport aux cas de figure précédents, s’étendent tout de même sur plus de 30 m.
L’ensemble de ces différents cas font en effet l’objet de dérogations aux normes de sécurité incendie, avec pour principe de compenser les manquements par rapport aux règles via des mesures compensatoires (détection plus précoce, vitesse de désenfumage accrue, stabilité au feu améliorée) censées permettre d’atteindre un niveau de sécurité satisfaisant (auquel les objectifs de sécurité sont remplis).
ormiston
Local time: 15:33
English translation:fire stability
Explanation:
This is the correct term and applies to composite structures. It is not at all the same as "fire rating", which applies to components rather than the structure they make up. Of course, the fire rating of components does affect fire stability, but it is not the only factor. In your context, the danger posed by the dead-end corridors either side of the fire exit is compensated inter alia by ensuring that they don't collapse (for a specified period) in the event of fire.

The issue is fully explained in http://www.bre.co.uk/filelibrary/pdf/ rpts/partb/compartmentation.pdf

Also see: http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa /cm200102/cmselect/cmtlgr/482/48211.htm


www.promat.co.uk/products/fire-protection/durasteel.aspx?.....
"meets the fire stability and integrity requirements for up to 120 mins. – It maintains 75% cross-section and is suitable for smoke extract ducting. "

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Note added at 11 hrs (2013-10-03 07:58:30 GMT)
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Note that "load-bearing capacity" is not a substitute term for fire stability.
Selected response from:

B D Finch
France
Local time: 15:33
Grading comment
this input was very helpful but it's hard to swallow the term (unlike e.g. 'water resistance' which is clearly not the resistance OF water) which sounds like keeping the fire stable.
3 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +1fire stability
B D Finch
3 +1fire rating
mickymccay
4fire resistance (loadbearing)
Bourth
Summary of reference entries provided
Termium entry
Ben Karl

Discussion entries: 7





  

Answers


1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
fire rating


Explanation:
I was looking at "stabilité au feu" in google .fr and then "fire rating of... " in google.uk that seems to be the equivalent as in fire rating of plywood/fire rating of steel etc it might work here.

mickymccay
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  philgoddard: Or fire resistance.
12 mins
  -> I agree that would work as well I thourht i would try to find something else as "résistance au feu " wasn't in the original. Thanks Micky

neutral  B D Finch: This is not equivalent and means something quite different. Only components available for pre-testing by the certificating authority can be fire rated.
12 hrs
  -> I think you 're right I was just googling around to see what I could find. I did find mention of the fire-resistance rating of a building but I suppose fire resistance or fire stability "tout court" world best translate it. Which translation was chosen?
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11 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
fire stability


Explanation:
This is the correct term and applies to composite structures. It is not at all the same as "fire rating", which applies to components rather than the structure they make up. Of course, the fire rating of components does affect fire stability, but it is not the only factor. In your context, the danger posed by the dead-end corridors either side of the fire exit is compensated inter alia by ensuring that they don't collapse (for a specified period) in the event of fire.

The issue is fully explained in http://www.bre.co.uk/filelibrary/pdf/ rpts/partb/compartmentation.pdf

Also see: http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa /cm200102/cmselect/cmtlgr/482/48211.htm


www.promat.co.uk/products/fire-protection/durasteel.aspx?.....
"meets the fire stability and integrity requirements for up to 120 mins. – It maintains 75% cross-section and is suitable for smoke extract ducting. "

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 11 hrs (2013-10-03 07:58:30 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Note that "load-bearing capacity" is not a substitute term for fire stability.

B D Finch
France
Local time: 15:33
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 144
Grading comment
this input was very helpful but it's hard to swallow the term (unlike e.g. 'water resistance' which is clearly not the resistance OF water) which sounds like keeping the fire stable.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Philippe Etienne: If I understood well, fire stability is a sub-feature of fire resistance
3 hrs
  -> Thanks Philippe.
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3294 days   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
fire resistance (loadbearing)


Explanation:
"Fire stability" is indeed a convenient translation for "stabilité au feu", which is itself a convenient and common shortcut, but a remnant from another age (you know how the French retain old terms long after the technology has changed; before adopting the REI system (read on), they had SF (stabilité au feu), PF (pare-flammes) and CF (coupe-feu)).
It is one of the three components of fire resistance that are denoted R, E, and I, which signify Resistance (Load-Bearing), Integrity (the E appears to come from Etanchéité), and Insulation, i.e. the ability of a building element to remain standing (R), to prevent the spread of flame and gas (E), and to prevent heat transfer to the side not exposed to fire (I).
It is indeed odd that in English we have retained the E of "Etanchéité" but not the S of "stabilité", which surely says a lot about the validity (not) of "fire stability".
Even in French "stabilité" is not used, in the purest of terms, other than to define what is meant by "Résistance mécanique ou force portante" (for which they, like us, use the R of REI) or in reference to their old "SF" system.

"REI est un acronyme utilisé pour indiquer la résistance au feu d’un élément de construction (composant ou structurel):
• R, indique la Résistance mécanique ou force portante, c’est-à-dire la capacité des structures à conserver leur stabilité sous l’action du feu.
• E, indique l’Étanchéité au feu sans transmission de flammes et de gaz chauds pouvant s’enflammer sur la face non exposée.
• I, indique l’Isolation thermique, c’est à dire la transmission limitée de la température au travers de l’ouvrage."

"la résistance au feu évalue (en fractions d'heures ou heures) la capacité d'un matériau ou équipement à retarder la propagation d'un incendie (ou à limiter ses effets) jusqu'à l'arrivée des secours. Trois critères sont ainsi définis :
• R = STABILITÉ AU FEU (SF)
• RE ou [sic!] E = pare-flammes (PF)
• REI ou [sic!] EI = coupe-feu (CF)"

"The REI marking consists of the following elements:
• R = LOAD-BEARING. The ability of a construction element to preserve its’ mechanical characteristics and the relevant load capacity during a normal fire.
• E = Integrity. In other words, the structure’s ability to NOT allow the passage or production of gas or vapor to the area NOT exposed to the fire.
• I = Thermal Insulation. To clarify, the ability of a structure to reduce within a temperature limit the transfer of heat to the unexposed (cold) side. The temperature limit is usually 140°C."
Really, 'stabilité au feu' corresponds to "loadbearing fire resistance" or "structural fire resistance". True, "fire stability" is defined by ISO, which states that the elements concerned can be loadbearing or non-loadbearing and that an element must "preserve its mechanical characteristics and the relevant load capacity", i.e. if it is non-loadbearing, then its "relevant load capacity" is zero, beyond its ability to support itself, that is, i.e. its eigenload. For things like insulation, which are not loadbearing, you will find reference to its "integrity fire resistance" and "insulation fire resistance".
Since it will often be obvious in the context that structural stability is being addressed (and not integrity and insulation capacity), "fire resistance" will be sufficient in such cases, though I have been known to append "(loadbearing)" when there might be uncertainty.



Bourth
France
Local time: 15:33
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8
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Reference comments


14 mins peer agreement (net): +1
Reference: Termium entry

Reference information:
fire stability = stabilité au feu


    Reference: http://www.btb.termiumplus.gc.ca/tpv2alpha/alpha-eng.html?la...
Ben Karl
United States
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
Note to reference poster
Asker: I know and thank you. But google gives one citation from a Luxembourg based website and little else, apart from stables on fire..!


Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
agree  B D Finch: Yes, only just looked at your reference. The ISO (Termium's source here) is pretty authoritative and Termium gives a clear definition in both English and French.
15 hrs
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