alors que

14:58 Dec 2, 2012 

can express a non-contrasting difference between two situations, as in "He ate bacon for breakfast, while she had toast", i.e. different, but not opposite. I think that's the meaning of "alors que" in this case. "Whereas" usually indicates a clear contrast.

@BD: you're quite right, we are prone to over-thinking source texts. Part of the fun :-)

12:12 Dec 2, 2012 

I think that any temporal meaning in the source text is very weak, while the comparison is certainly there but weak. Translators, being linguists, face the problem that we are frequently more aware of and concerned with niceties of meaning than were the writers of the source texts. So, we are often dealing with the question "What would the writer have meant if he or she had bothered to think about the particular distinction we are concerned with?"

16:51 Dec 1, 2012 

Of course, of course - I simply meant that as in this particular case it was clearly a comparison being made (no temporal element at all) there was no actual difference between 'while' or a 'whereas'. For comparisons I would ALWAYS prefer to use 'whereas'. And now, I am going to leave that guy to get on with his ironing...a man's work is never done! :)

12:02 Dec 1, 2012 

Well, in some contexts, there can be an implied difference, of greater or lesser significance depending on the situation. In particular, where the 'while' has any kind of temporal connotation, and/or where 'whereas' implies some kind of comparison. Both terms are used with much weaker meanings as well, where they might be regarded as interchangeable; but not always!

Cf. "Nero fiddled while Rome burned" — temporal meaning, would sound silly to replace it with 'whereas' here!

"He did the ironing while the chicken was cooking" (temporal)

"He did the ironing, whereas she did the cooking" (comparison)

Given the etymology, I always regard 'alors que...' as starting off from the same temporal connotation as 'while', and 'tandis que...' as having more the sense of 'whereas' in EN. And in FR, just as in EN, they are often used interchangeably — but not in all circumstances.

03:14 Dec 1, 2012 

IMO, the only difference is one of register – unless using "while" causes ambiguity.
For more info, see Grammar Girl (who apparently wound up eating humble pie on this question): http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/although-versus-while.a...

At least she is honest and frank – plus her writing is pretty clear.

00:58 Dec 1, 2012 

all these whiles and whereases are all very well, but personally, I don't see the difference. If anyone can explain to me the difference between these two sentences, I will organise a prize: "John is tall, whereas Peter is short" - "John is tall, while Peter is short". There is no difference. They mean exactly the same!

01:11 Nov 29, 2012 

...but there's a still larger question about the meaning and relationship of the clauses linked by "alors que."

01:08 Nov 29, 2012 

things got confused by assuming alors que means whereas here. imo it means while

01:00 Nov 29, 2012 

French2English knows how to transliate "alors que"; the difficulty lies elsewhere in the text.

Perhaps this should have been a Forum question, not a Kudoz question? But I may not be a good judge of that (a little slim on Forum participation myself).

00:57 Nov 29, 2012 

It's not legalese but regrettably there is no grammar/parts of speech category so general is closest. Unfortunately it's tied in with conversation but this is definitely general and not legalese or any other specialist field. The discussion seems to have taken on a life of its own and gone away from the actual Kudoz question: how to translate the conjunctive phrase 'alors que' in the context. However even this much discussion shouldn't cloud the fact that it's a basic conjunction commonly used in (written) French.

23:51 Nov 28, 2012 

...the expression "alors que" doesn't seem to be the issue... is it?

23:49 Nov 28, 2012 

...regarding reclassification of the question, all I can say is God help us all if this sort of thing ever becomes General, Conversational or, even worse, a Greeting :(

23:48 Nov 28, 2012 

yes, looks like you agree with Tony's suggestion and I am now seeing it that way too.... pretty sure that is the distinction being made. Thanks for input.

22:50 Nov 28, 2012 

the distinction is between what the equipment will be used for (besoins) and the equipment itself (ajout), so between the needs and the means.

Bureaucratic language is a one-way conversation...:-)

21:32 Nov 28, 2012 

Aaahhh... I am glad that you too see a bit of vagueness here too, which makes me think that I am not going mad after all. I think, on the strength of what you say, and CC's suggestion, I will definitely ask the client for clarification, just to be sure... and I think you may be right that the distinction probably lies more in the 'besoins' bit. ..... thanks, this is very helpful.

21:26 Nov 28, 2012 

The distinction being made is between l'ajout d'équipment, which is going to include the besoins pour l'ajout en consolidation (presumably, subsequent), and then that actual subsequent ajout en consolidation.

It looks to me (vaguely) as if they are saying that the basic policy decisions are being taken as to 'what we need now and what we are going to need next', so that when they get to the 'what we need next' bit, some of the decision-making has already been done.

21:24 Nov 28, 2012 

Perhaps they are somewhat different, but also close enough to ask the Client about the distinction being made.

21:09 Nov 28, 2012 

....yes, I think you are much closer to the trail.... I wondered if that was where it lay.... and if so, I feel it is a rather vague distinction....

21:07 Nov 28, 2012 

my point was that I don't see the DISTINCTION BEING MADE!!!

20:48 Nov 28, 2012 

Perhaps the distinction is between:
• est fondé sur des paramètres nationaux et sur des directives régionales --and--
• tient compte de directives nationales et régionales.