would certainly

English translation: ('conditional' - suggesting diplomatic tone)

07:38 Oct 7, 2010

English language (monolingual) [PRO]
Government / Politics /

English term or phrase: would certainly

I have to translate a conclusion of a member of an investigation committee (non-native speaker of English), and as the subject is highly sensitive (the reason why I can't give more context, sorry!), I want to make sure to get the meaning absolutely right. So how do you understand "would certainly" in the following sentence:

These actions would certainly deserve strong disciplinary measures to be taken against them by the relevant authorities ...

To me, this sounds a bit like indirect speech, though it's not. Does the speaker mean "these actions certainly deserve disciplinary measures" or rather "these actions should be punished by disciplinary measures"? Thank you for your comments!

ibz KudoZ activity Questions: 2152 (8 open) (215 without valid answers) (126 closed without grading) Answers: 721
Local time: 04:02

Selected answer:('conditional' - suggesting diplomatic tone)

Explanation:
If it is a sensitive document as you state, I suggest the author is simply expressing "remoteness" - trying to make his conclusion more diplomatic or milder.

Instead of saying what he thinks "these actions have to be punished", he is being diplomatic through the use of 'remoteness' - in English this is expressed with the same auxiliaries and verb forms as the conditional.

So in your target language you need to use an appropriate linguistic construction to convey this diplomacy. Maybe a conditional, or a 'subjunctive' (which English has lost), or another construction such as "some might think", "it would be understandable if some think" ...

Selected response from:

Craig Meulen
United Kingdom
Local time: 03:02

Grading comment

Thank you all for your great help! Unfortunately points can't be split, so I going to award them to Craig who got the most agrees. I hope that's ok with you all :-)
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

SUMMARY OF ALL EXPLANATIONS PROVIDED

3 +6

('conditional' - suggesting diplomatic tone)

Craig Meulen

4 +2

If these actions were taken...

Jack Doughty

4 +1

certainly do justify, but...

Tony M

most likely their punishment would be strong

Alexandra Taggart

3 +1

should certainly

Sheila Wilson

(but I doubt the authorities will not)

BdiL

Discussion entries: 4

Answers

6 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +2

use of "would certainly" in this sentence If these actions were taken...

Explanation:
It is conditional. It refers to actions which have not yet been taken, but if they were, they would certainly deserve strong disciplinary measures to be taken against them by the relevant authorities ...

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Note added at 55 mins (2010-10-07 08:33:18 GMT)
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In that case, "would" should be omitted.

Jack Doughty
United Kingdom
Local time: 03:02
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 56

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thank you, Jack. That's exactly my problem: These actions were actually taken, so the conditional doesn't work here.

1 hr confidence:

peer agreement (net): +6

('conditional' - suggesting diplomatic tone)

Craig Meulen
United Kingdom
Local time: 03:02
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 4

Grading comment

Thank you all for your great help! Unfortunately points can't be split, so I going to award them to Craig who got the most agrees. I hope that's ok with you all :-)

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thanks for this comment, Craig. I'll try to find an adequate solution keeping this in mind.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

B D Finch: Yes, but the beneficiary of the diplomacy is more likely to be the "relevant authorities". i.e. If the relevant authorities were performing as they should, the culprit should be strung up by their thumbs and thoroughly flogged.

9 mins

-> without more context I can't agree or disagree with your interpretation.

agree

Allison Wright (X): Agree impeccable diplomacy. You seem to have a political "hot potato"! Convey this in the strongest possible terms without giving offence to target audience.

3 hrs

agree

Veronika McLaren

3 hrs

agree

Tina Vonhof (X): 'Would' stands for 'everyone would agree that they do deserve strong punishment'.

4 hrs

-> I'm not sure I agree with you completely, Tina. But your phrase might inspire the asker how he can translate into the target language.

agree

Tony M: I think this could be the meaning here — but it might not necessarily be; there may well be another possible interpretation...

10 hrs

-> Without more context it's difficult to be certain!

agree

Phong Le

1 day 31 mins

3 hrs confidence:

most likely their punishment would be strong

Explanation:
but,to which extent - the author cannot say, as it's up to the relevant authorities to decide.

Alexandra Taggart
Russian Federation
Local time: 05:02
Native speaker of:

English,

Russian

3 hrs confidence:

(but I doubt the authorities will not)

Explanation:
The speaker is using this (defective) auxiliary verb (IMO it is a conditional, but this is not that important) to mean: this is what should be done by the authorities, however, I question that it shall be done (and yet I do not wish to express it overtly).
In fact there is some diplomacy in it.
Maurizio

BdiL
Italy
Local time: 04:02
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

Italian

9 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

should certainly

Explanation:
I can't be sure, of course, but my 12-years' experience teaching business English leads me to suspect that the writer may not have been entirely sure about 'would', 'should' etc.

Only you know, asker, if this fits the context. You say the actions were taken - no conditional. Was this writer perhaps unhappy with the disciplinary measures taken i.e. they should have been punished more severely?

Sheila Wilson
Spain
Local time: 03:02
Works in field
Native speaker of:

English

12 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

certainly do justify, but...

Explanation:
...the decision is not up to me.

Although the difference may be terribly small, I think this interpretation is distinct from the others so far.

1) The acts have taken place, so it can't be that conditional then
2) As Craig says, it could simply be diplomatic, like the use of 'allegedly' to distance oneself from something potentially libellous
3) As Maurizio says, it could also be implying that the writer doubts that such punishment will indeed be forthcoming

or, as I suggest here:

4) Simply that it is the writer's opinion that the punishment should fit the crime, only... they themselves are not actually the ones who are going to be handing it out; so it's sort of "If it were left up to me, he would be hanged!"

Tony M
France
Local time: 04:02
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 12

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