soigné autoplacant

English translation: self-compacting concrete with high quality, light grey, visible finish

13:41 Sep 23, 2010
French to English translations [PRO]
Tech/Engineering - Architecture / Building facade
French term or phrase: soigné autoplacant
I'm actually struggling with the whole string of words here, with non-existent punctuation, so forgive me if these two don't actually go together here. This appears in a description of the facade components for the administration building of a new power plant.

Eléments préfabriqués en béton brut gris clair soigné autoplaçant, profil en dents de scie.

I just cannot see how the soigné autoplacant bit fits in.

I'd be extremely grateful for any suggestions here.
Claire Cox
United Kingdom
Local time: 11:04
English translation:self-compacting concrete with high quality, light grey, visible finish
Explanation:
"Béton autoplacant" is not used correctly here. It should almost certainly be "auto-compactant" in French or Self-compacting in English.

Self-compacting concrete does self-level, but then any concrete which is liquid enough will do that.

The point here is that only self-compacting concrete is appropriate certain pre-cast or pre-fabricated concrete elements because it does not need vibrating and this is especially important when the formwork (or mould) is complicated and the finish needs to be almost perfect.

Self-levelling concrete or self-levelling cement is primarily used for building screeds (chape in French) where the necessity to have a perfectly horizonal floor for placing tiles, marble, parquet is paramount. It is the finishing layer on top of a concrete slab.

béton brut = visible concrete in this context.
Selected response from:

Richard Hedger
Switzerland
Local time: 12:04
Grading comment
Thanks Richard - sounds very neat: I'm convinced!
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +3finished, self-levelling concrete
B D Finch
4 +1self-compacting concrete with high quality, light grey, visible finish
Richard Hedger
3light grey smooth finished self-placing concrete
Alain Jourdan
Summary of reference entries provided
liz askew
SCC - self-compacting/consolidating concrete
Bourth (X)

Discussion entries: 2





  

Answers


1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
light grey smooth finished self-placing concrete


Explanation:
Hard to tell from the description. It doesn't make full sense either...

'Soigné' surely refers to the surface finish of the precast concrete

'Béton Autoplaçant' is a type of concrete poured onsite which is very fluid and does not require vibrating, as it settles by gravity alone. It enables very smooth finishes.
This of course clashes with the precast units ('éléments préfabriqués')


    Reference: http://www.ipo.gov.uk/p-find-publication-getPDF.pdf?PatentNo...
    Reference: http://www.lafarge.com/wps/portal/3_5-Glossaire#Self-placing...
Alain Jourdan
Local time: 11:04
Works in field
Native speaker of: French
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +3
finished, self-levelling concrete


Explanation:
Based on the French description of "autoplaçant" in DicoBat, which is definitely a description of self-levelling concrete.

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Note added at 1 hr (2010-09-23 14:50:38 GMT)
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"Qualificatif de bétons de fibres* modernes et mortiers spéciaux pour dallqges mis en place à la pompe*, qui s'étalent et se répartissent d'eux-mêmes." That is a description of self-levelling, rather than self-compacting.

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Note added at 1 hr (2010-09-23 15:19:29 GMT)
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As can be seen from the reference below, there is a difference between self-levelling and self-compacting, though it is usual for the concrete to have both properties. A concrete could be self-levelling, while leaving voids below the level surface. If the concrete is not mechanically compacted, it does make sense. On the other hand, a self-levelling concrete that was not self-compacting could be compacted by vibration, though not by tamping.

"Foam concrete is naturally self-levelling and self-compacting, filling the smallest voids, cavities and seams within the pouring area.

In excavations with poor soils that cannot be easily compacted, foam concrete forms a 100% compacted foundation over the soft sub-soil. Compaction of conventional, granular backfill against retaining structures or deep foundations can cause damage or movement to the adjacent structure. In these situations, foam concrete with its reduced lateral loading is a safe solution."
http://www.foamconcrete.co.uk/self-levelling-self-compacting...

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Note added at 2 hrs (2010-09-23 15:53:16 GMT)
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I think that brut and soigné can be reconciled if the former is taken to mean that the concrete doesn not have an applied finish e.g. paint.

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Note added at 2 hrs (2010-09-23 15:55:08 GMT)
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E.g. "Pour obtenir une finition soignée des façades d'un immeuble de logements en béton blanc coulé en place, les entreprises ont adopté un coffrage adapté à la trame du projet et positionné en façade sur tours d'étaiement."
http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=17957948

B D Finch
France
Local time: 12:04
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 163
Notes to answerer
Asker: Hi Barbara - I can see that self-levelling would make sense but I cannot reconcile the use of brut and soigné at the same time - how can it be both untreated and finished?


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  kashew: But, somebody is not going to like the double el!
5 mins
  -> Thanks kashew. Afraid I use British spelling and am sure that the Asker can change that to US spelling if she needs to. I'd only make mistakes if I tried to write with US spelling.

agree  Marion Feildel (X): "The key to creating self-consolidating concrete (SCC), also referred to as self-compacting, self-leveling, or self-placing concrete, is to produce a very flowable mortar that retains a viscosity great enough...."
17 mins
  -> Thanks Marion, see note above.

agree  Evans (X)
53 mins
  -> Thanks Gilla. Richard's answer is, however, convincing.
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5 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
self-compacting concrete with high quality, light grey, visible finish


Explanation:
"Béton autoplacant" is not used correctly here. It should almost certainly be "auto-compactant" in French or Self-compacting in English.

Self-compacting concrete does self-level, but then any concrete which is liquid enough will do that.

The point here is that only self-compacting concrete is appropriate certain pre-cast or pre-fabricated concrete elements because it does not need vibrating and this is especially important when the formwork (or mould) is complicated and the finish needs to be almost perfect.

Self-levelling concrete or self-levelling cement is primarily used for building screeds (chape in French) where the necessity to have a perfectly horizonal floor for placing tiles, marble, parquet is paramount. It is the finishing layer on top of a concrete slab.

béton brut = visible concrete in this context.



    Reference: http://www.holcim.com/holcimweb/gc/FRBE/uploads/61146_Fiche_...
    Reference: http://www.efnarc.org/pdf/SCCGuidelinesMay2005.pdf
Richard Hedger
Switzerland
Local time: 12:04
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 16
Grading comment
Thanks Richard - sounds very neat: I'm convinced!

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Bourth (X): See Refs.
2 hrs
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Reference comments


33 mins
Reference

Reference information:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QXstFrD...

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Note added at 34 mins (2010-09-23 14:15:45 GMT)
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[PDF]
SECTION 03360 CONCRETE FINISHING
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - Quick View
by C FINISHING - Related articles
C. Rubbed Finish: Apply the following to smooth-formed finished concrete: Select one rubbed finish from subparas below if required. 1. Smooth-Rubbed Finish: ...
www.buildsite.com/dbderived/lambert/derived_files/derived26...

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Note added at 34 mins (2010-09-23 14:16:22 GMT)
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tamponnage soigné > protective cushioning/padding - ProZ.com
31 Aug 2010 ... (KudoZ) French to English translation of tamponnage soigné: protective cushioning/padding [Transporting art - Art, Arts & Crafts, ...
www.proz.com/kudoz/...to.../3998603-tamponnage_soigné.html - Cached

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Note added at 36 mins (2010-09-23 14:17:59 GMT)
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bêton autoplaçant/autocompactant > self-compacting concrete
- [ Translate this page ]
bêton autoplaçant/autocompactant > self-compacting concrete. One translation of the француски term bêton autoplaçant/autocompactant in англиски is ...
mac.proz.com/?sp=gloss/term&id=4949014 - Cached

hope the refs. help.

Not my area.

liz askew
United Kingdom
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 23

Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
neutral  B D Finch: Autoplaçant and autocompactant are not the same.
37 mins
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7 hrs
Reference: SCC - self-compacting/consolidating concrete

Reference information:
Auto(-)plaçant IS correct French. Cf the AFGC recommendations thereon (http://www.afgc.asso.fr/Documents-scientifiques-et-technique... Self-compacting concrete is the British term, while it's (mostly) called self-consolidating concrete in the US. Indeed, used for moulded parts, but important for things like nuclear power plants or any structural concrete with high reinforcement density for the concrete flows freely around the rebar and into locations that cannot remotely be attained by pokers.

Bourth (X)
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 539
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