la réification des archives

English translation: the reifying/limiting nature of archives

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:la réification des archives
English translation:the reifying/limiting nature of archives
Entered by: Helen Shiner

18:35 Jun 9, 2009
French to English translations [PRO]
History / US - Soviet relations
French term or phrase: la réification des archives
... en mettant en garde *** contre la réification *** des archives et l'illusion de trouver la réalité dans les details qui reproduisent des méandres psychologiques. (La Crise Cubaine)
kashew
France
Local time: 22:30
the reifying/limiting nature of archives
Explanation:
I think it comes down to the way in which archives and their contents can 'limit' our understanding of things - in part because their holdings are partial, but also because they may well be skewed in favour of one particular take on historical events. Say, be lodged by the dominant culture, for instance, and have no record of how those events were received by minority groups.

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Note added at 4 days (2009-06-14 15:04:59 GMT) Post-grading
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Thanks for the points, kashew.
Selected response from:

Helen Shiner
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:30
Grading comment
Thanks to all - a good range of plausible answers : not easy to choose.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +1reification
Pierre POUSSIN
3 +2the fetishisation of the archives
Melissa McMahon
3 +1mistaking the archives for the events themselves
Susan Nicholls
4take your pick
B D Finch
4And there's always objectification...
Manuel Malherbe
4limiting the interpretation of history by only relying on material held in the archives
Catherine Gilsenan
4the fallacy of reification …
rkillings
4the reifying/limiting nature of archives
Helen Shiner


Discussion entries: 3





  

Answers


10 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
reification


Explanation:
Same word from latin: res, rei (the thing) and facere (verb : faire)
réification: transformation into something...

Pierre POUSSIN
France
Local time: 22:30
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 24
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thanks: Yes, but 'nobody" knows what it means!


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  rkillings
13 hrs
  -> Merci!
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50 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
mistaking the archives for the events themselves


Explanation:
It is difficult to see exactly what is meant here, since on a basic level archives are things to start with. It might therefore be a warning against over-valuing material on file. Perhaps something like the following might work, unless your context suggests another meaning:

warning against mistaking the archives for the events themselves,
and thinking to find reality in details...



Susan Nicholls
Local time: 06:30
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Helen Shiner: It is not really about 'mistaking' as such, but being limited in one's comprehension of an event by the partial archival holdings.
21 mins
  -> "taking", rather than "mistaking", perhaps.

agree  Melissa McMahon: it's certainly about being limited in understanding - by mistaking the archives for the reality they are traces of! That's my understanding of "reification" here.
10 hrs
  -> Thank you Melissa.
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
take your pick


Explanation:
Reification is treating something abstract as though it is concrete reality. Archives are not abstract; they are real bits of paper or microfiche, or whatever containing real evidence. However, they have lots of lacunae and participants' journals and suchlike can be very biased and selective. On the other hand, how does one understand events without referring to archive records? I think the writer is probably counselling caution in leaping in with both feet and uncritically, over-interpreting the record and imagining that it is possible to know exactly what occurred.

So, "reification of the archive material" is a possible translation.

Less formally: "taking the archive material as gospel truth".

Any records need selection and interpreting and those processes are also never neutral.

B D Finch
France
Local time: 22:30
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 35
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
And there's always objectification...


Explanation:
... and/or objectify. Too many people have given up on Latin and Classics, unfortunately!

Manuel Malherbe
Local time: 22:30
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
limiting the interpretation of history by only relying on material held in the archives


Explanation:
-

Catherine Gilsenan
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:30
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
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11 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
the fetishisation of the archives


Explanation:
It seems that "reification" is used here to express the archives being taken for the "realité" they are a record of (as Susan suggests above) - "l'illusion de trouver la réalité dans les details" - so the "res" in "réification" is, rightly or wrongly, understood as "reality" rather than "thing".

Since the author is clear about what he means by reification, you could just keep it: it's as right or wrong in the original as in English.

Alternatively, a word for mistaking a connected object for the "thing itself" is "fetishisation".

Melissa McMahon
Australia
Local time: 06:30
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 16

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Susan Nicholls
1 hr
  -> Thanks Susan

agree  Jocelyne S: I agree that 'reification' could be left here (and is as understood in EN as in FR). I like your second suggestion too, if the asker wants to avoid 'reification'.
1 hr
  -> Thanks Jocelyne
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13 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
the fallacy of reification …


Explanation:
That "nobody" knows what it means is a lame excuse for avoiding the mot juste. If anything, more people have put the word on the Web in English than in French, to the tune of about a half-million Ghits.
If readers of your translation don't know what it means, let 'em look it up, say, on Wikipedia. But you could take the liberty of helping them out by identifying the relevant one of the seven different meanings (!) given in the Wikipedia article. (You can't go wrong here. Even if the writer is a hardcore Marxist who is thinking of Verdinglichung, the sentence confirms that it's an illusion.)


    Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reification
rkillings
United States
Local time: 13:30
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
the reifying/limiting nature of archives


Explanation:
I think it comes down to the way in which archives and their contents can 'limit' our understanding of things - in part because their holdings are partial, but also because they may well be skewed in favour of one particular take on historical events. Say, be lodged by the dominant culture, for instance, and have no record of how those events were received by minority groups.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 days (2009-06-14 15:04:59 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Thanks for the points, kashew.

Helen Shiner
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:30
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 32
Grading comment
Thanks to all - a good range of plausible answers : not easy to choose.
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)



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