échelle de perroquet

11:55 May 26, 2009
This question was closed without grading. Reason: Other

French to English translations [PRO]
Bus/Financial - Investment / Securities / Investor ratings
French term or phrase: échelle de perroquet
In a document concerning ratings granted to investors, the *échelle de perroquet* is described as follows: "diminution de la note an année N+2 si un émetteur progresse en année N+1 puis maintient son effort sans progresser a nouveau". Any suggestions would be much appreciated. Thanks in advance for your assistance.
Sarah Russell
United Kingdom
Local time: 03:18


Summary of answers provided
4snakes and ladders
B D Finch
3gull wing ladder, step-by-step
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
2ladderlike
liz askew
Summary of reference entries provided
Must be many things
Bourth (X)

  

Answers


58 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
gull wing ladder, step-by-step


Explanation:
My suggestion is a tit-for-tat type term.
In diving baots, and general nautical contexts, an "échelle de perroquet" is one which has at least this feature :
open on the sides.

Other features may vary, with the rung starting from the central vertical stem and going just to one side, in which case, the half-rungs alternate, left / right. Another variant is where the rungs run either side of the central vertical stem and go right across, thus not alternating...

The idea is that swimmers and divers with their fins on, can get out of the water and scramble back on board realtively easily.

In pictures :

http://bateaushop.com/catalog/images/Echelle_33.jpg

http://www.go2marine.com/category.do?no=12751

At the risk of appearing completely ridiculous oin my choice of term, at least this should help you in presenting one possible interpretation of the image seeking to be conveyed.

My reading produces an idea in context of a step-by-step progression.





Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 04:18
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8
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50 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
snakes and ladders


Explanation:
If the issuer simply stands still in the second year, instead of improving on the progress made in the first year, they are marked down. So on the basis that what doesn't go up must come down, snakes and ladders seems to be appropriate.

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Note added at 59 mins (2009-05-26 12:55:33 GMT)
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Here's a link to a picture of what an échelle de perroquet looks like:
http://pagesperso-orange.fr/yves.lavisse/bato/mar03.jpg

Presumably the steps do not have to be at the same height on either side of the centre bar. Parrots must have difficulties with ordinary ladders. However, I don't think that a literal picture of an échelle de perroquet is what is meant here.

B D Finch
France
Local time: 04:18
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: It would be lovely if it worked, but the rules of snakes and ladders as I know them, mean that you can go up or down, that your fortune, progress or reverse, are not within your hands. /// Ah, so do I, which is why for me, the S&L parallel is risky. Maybe
2 mins
  -> Thanks Nikki, yes that would be right if one were being absolutely literal. However, I see it more as about constant threat of being marked down if one doesn't keep progressing in relation to the previous year. Fear, irrespective of luck or control.
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28 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
ladderlike


Explanation:
http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:yjRIW3vFp7oJ:www.revue-...

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Note added at 28 mins (2009-05-26 12:24:40 GMT)
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see page 6

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Note added at 31 mins (2009-05-26 12:27:30 GMT)
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Grammars of identity/alterity: a structural approach - Google Books Result
by Gerd Baumann, André Gingrich, European ... - 2004 - Social Science - 219 pages
in preserving a ladder-like hierarchy in society, which may be the first ... is the gradation of groups or individual traits on a ladder-like ideal scheme. ...
books.google.co.uk/books?isbn=1571816984...


it's a start...

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Note added at 6 days (2009-06-01 12:22:59 GMT)
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So, what was your solution please?

liz askew
United Kingdom
Local time: 03:18
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Notes to answerer
Asker: Liz, I went with Bourth's suggestion of 'never-ending ladder'. However, as this suggestion was only posted as a reference comment, it does not appear on the 'official' list of proposed answers, which is why I closed the question without grading.

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Reference comments


1 hr
Reference: Must be many things

Reference information:
I've found "échelle du perroquet" to refer to a never-ending ladder, a bit like those climbing walls they used to have in McDonald's: as you climb, your weight ratchets the ladder down, so you're no higher than you were. The analogy sort of works with your ratings system, but not exactly.

Seems to be used a lot in reference to the incomes of CEO's; either because they are comparing with other incomes and, parrot-fashion, imitating the highest existing income; and/or because every time there are too many people at the top of the salary ladder, someone increases his own salary, so the ladder effectively "ratchets down" like the climbing walls.

Used also for any sort of extension, as with maintenance guarantees, where if a part is replaced the guarantee for the whole device is extended for the "new life" of the replacement part. Again, analagous but not exact.

Notions of "paternoster", "hamster wheel"???

Dans un tel contexte de totale maîtrise des décisions, la flambée des rémunérations des dirigeants s’explique aisément. Un phénomène d’ “ECHELLE DE PERROQUET” s’est mis en place : pour accréditer les performances de leur société, les dirigeants ne pouvant se permettre d’être en reste se sont fixé des rémunérations aussi hautes que celles de leurs concurrents
http://www.nouveleconomiste.fr/s1474/AVH-Aglietta.html

Paradoxalement, le premier facteur de hausse est la transparence salariale imposée il y a sept ans par la loi NRE, qui a alimenté un mouvement de mise à niveau. «Les salaires des PDG français étaient à l''époque moins élevés que ceux de leurs homologues anglais, allemands ou italiens», confirme Daniel Lebègue. Le rattrapage s''est poursuivi au niveau national. «C''est ce qu''on appelle L''ECHELLE DE PERROQUET, explique Marc Lamy, président du cabinet de chasseur de têtes Boyden. Un dirigeant accepte rarement que sa rémunération soit fixée dans le bas de la fourchette, parce que, pour lui, cela signifie qu''il est mauvais. Donc, il demande qu''elle soit comprise dans le quartile supérieur, avec pour conséquence UNE CONTAGION sur les salaires des autres PDG.»
http://www.challenges.fr/magazine/coulisses/0119.2042/

On peut aussi expliquer les niveaux des mandats actuels au fait que les agences sont passées maîtres dans un jeu: celui de la course à l'échalotte ou de L'ECHELLE DE PERROQUET.*
En voici la logique:
Exemple (toute ressemblance avec une situation existante ou ayant existé est purement fortuite):
Monsieur X veut vendre sa maison
Il contacte 3 agences
la n°1 estime sa maison à 100
la n°2, qui veut emporter le mandat, estime sa maison à 120
la n°3 estime la maison à 125
Monsieur X (qui n'a pas compris que prix de mandat ne vaut pas nécessairement le prix du mandat mais que le prix de son bien est celui qu'un acheteur voudra bien y mettre)
découvre que sa maison vaut cher et se dit qu'elle vaut bien 130.
Il contacte alors l'agence n°4 et lui demande de la vendre à 150.
L'agence n°4 lui répond: "bien entendu, Monsieur X, votre maison vaut 150, cette maison de charme a du potentiel!!!"
Evidemment, vous me rétorquerez que Monsieur X, s'il savait faire une étude de marché saurait évaluer sa maison justement. Mais Monsieur X se dit aussi très justement, que vu la commission payée par l'acheteur, l'agence pourrait la faire à sa place, l'étude de marché.
(ndlr: que la commision soit payée par l'acheteur ou le vendeur, peu importe. Ce qui compte, c'est le budget global de l'acheteur. Savoir la ventilation relève davantage de la psychologie.
Des acheteurs potentiels arrivent. Offres à 90.
Le vendeur se dit que ces acheteurs potentiels sont des escrocs et que vraiment cette agence est nulle de pas savoir vendre à son juste prix sa maison à potentiel.
http://www.le-blog-immobilier.com/2007/10/partout-en-fran.ht...

Sinon, c'est UNE COURSE SANS FIN, une ECHELLE DE PERROQUET, qui conduira à ...
www.assemblee-nationale.fr/13/cri/2008-2009/20090245.asp

Le contrat SOPACT (abribus) de 1994, d'une durée de 15 ans, prévoit un décompte de la durée du contrat à compter de l'installation du dernier mobilier compte tenu d'un plan de déploiement sur 3 ans. De même, l'article 2 pour les sanisettes comprend une clause de renouvellement dite en "ECHELLE DE PERROQUET" ayant pour objet de PROLONGER INDIRECTEMENT LA DUREE DU CONTRAT à l'occasion de l'implantation d'un nouveau modèle de sanitaire.
http://www.ccomptes.fr/fr/CRC13/documents/ROD/IFR200564.pdf

Bourth (X)
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 16
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