marmocchi

English translation: kids / brood

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

Italian term or phrase:	marmocchi
English translation:	kids / brood
Entered by:	Emanuela Galdelli

09:27 Dec 2, 2008

Italian to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Poetry & Literature

Italian term or phrase: marmocchi

I know what marmocchio is, but I don't know what is meant by it here. The writer is commenting Christina Stead's novel "The Man who Loved Children" (which I haven't read).

"Via via che la famiglia scivola nella degradazione e nella miseria, l’idealismo di Sam (THE HUSBAND/FATHER) si trasforma in ipocrita negazione della realtà, le scenate in cui Henny (THE MOTHER/WIFE) vomita di tutto diventano obbrobriose, lui si rifugia tra i suoi marmocchi che continua dissennatamente a generare per sfuggire al confronto con la realtà, lei affonda sempre più il naso nella spazzatura del mondo".

Open to all suggestions. TIA.

Paul O'Brien KudoZ activity Questions: 1438 (8 open) (5 without valid answers) (89 closed without grading) Answers: 769 Argentina
Local time: 02:03

kids

Explanation:
I think the literal translation is ok in this context, seeing that in the same phrase there's the verb "generare" (give birth). Sam in the novel has seven children!!!
http://www.liberonweb.com/asp/libro.asp?ISBN=8845918777

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Note added at 7 ore (2008-12-02 17:26:42 GMT)
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pauley, just a suggestion..remember that the title of the book is "l'uomo che amava i bambini". I think, despite of what Roberto says, that in this context the children are the only positive element. note that the verb "si rifugia" has certainly a positive meaning and that Sam is "idealista" and doesn't want to face up to the squalor of penury around him, therefore "si rifugia tra i suoi marmocchi e sfugge alla realtà" (marmocchi is absolutely not negative here) while the one who suffers from this terrible situation is his wife, that "affonda sempre più il naso nella spazzatura del mondo".

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Note added at 5 giorni (2008-12-07 22:57:55 GMT) Post-grading
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thanks pauley!

Selected response from:

Marika Costantini
Italy
Local time: 07:03

Grading comment

4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

3 +7

kids

Marika Costantini

4 +3

brood

Helen Matthews

3 +4

imps, tadpoles

RobertoR

Answers

25 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +3

marmocchi (in context) brood

Explanation:
... just another suggestion, to highlight the fact that it's a large family.... :-)

Helen Matthews
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:03
Native speaker of:

English

1 hr confidence:

peer agreement (net): +4

marmocchi (in context) imps, tadpoles

Explanation:
"Marmocchio" in italian has a depreciative meaning (although exceptions might exist in very informal talks). While "figli" or "bambini" is Kids or Brood, "marmocchi" carries in itself the vision of children who still are incapable of doing things by themselves - you could figure a child who can't blow his nose yet, and stares at his parent for help. If his parent is annoyed by it, unfortunately that's a marmocchio.

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Note added at 2 hrs (2008-12-02 12:22:55 GMT)
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You might need to find other synonims depending on the age (or actual behaviour?) of the kids... I don't know how old they are in the novel.

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Note added at 3 hrs (2008-12-02 12:45:30 GMT)
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Just one more comment - the "mood" of the whole text is one of disgust - not at all about the book, but about the condition of the characters. There's a deliberate choice of words (pay attention to that "vomita" there, which is most probably not literal) to convey a sense of cold disgust, most likely because the reviewer is trying to express the vividness of the author's portraits in prose.
Say, the "mood" of this text is like this: imagine a seasoned Social Security man who just enters an empty, derelict house where a recently-relocated family of 10 people have lived in terrible hygienic conditions, who looks around and cold-heartedly exclaims, "How could they live like that." That's the mood the reviewer used (as said, probably to express appreciation about the author's writing skills) and that you should try to keep in the translation.

RobertoR
Native speaker of:

Italian

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

justdone: non sono ingrado di giudicare la traduzione, ma sono d'accordo con il dispregiativo (anche se in effetti può essere usato anche in senso affettuoso). Un marmocchio non è solo un bimbio. È un bimbo che, più o meno volontariamente, rompe l'anima! Marcy

11 mins

-> Grazie! Thanks! :)

agree

Katia DG

25 mins

-> Grazie Katia!

neutral

Marika Costantini: questo è proprio uno dei pochi casi invece in cui il termine "marmocchi" non ha nessun senso dispregiativo. nel libro sam adora letteralmente i suoi figli e ogni sua azione è fatta in funzione loro. bisogna contestualizzare sempre per capire bene il senso

1 hr

-> Ciao Marika, per me il contesto che vale non é quello del libro, ma quello del testo da tradurre. Ho appena aggiunto una nota per spiegare quello che intendo.

agree

luskie: a hard one... what is conveyed as "disgusting" is not the kids but Sam's attitude toward them... as if the children were just *a bunch of procreation products* he (unconsciously?) used to avoid... marmocchi here is somehow similar to "ragazzini"... hth!

2 hrs

-> thanks Luskie - yes, I agree with you, it's hard to find the perfect word to translate it.

agree

Mirra_: anche io d'accordo col dispregiativo e 'tadpoles' :)

3 hrs

-> Grazie :)

11 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +7

marmocchi (in context)

kids

Marika Costantini
Italy
Local time: 07:03
Native speaker of:

Italian
PRO pts in category: 4

Notes to answerer

Asker: oh, how embarrassing. it's not refuge in his own brattish behaviour but in having even more kids. uh!

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English translation: kids / brood

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