This site uses cookies. Some of these cookies are essential to the operation of the site, while others help to improve your experience by providing insights into how the site is being used. For more information, please see the ProZ.com privacy policy.
Cookie settings
  1. KudoZ™ Top
  2. French to English
  3. Government / Politics

pays d'assistés

English translation: a "nation of scroungers"

05:43 Jan 31, 2007
French to English translations [PRO]
Government / Politics
French term or phrase: pays d'assistés
il s'agit d'une phrase de Sarkozy "je ne veux pas que la France devienne un pays d'assistés". je suis certaine qu'il y a un équivalent en anglais, mais je n'arrive pas à le trouver. quelqu'un connaît la réponse?
AA Poulin
Canada
Local time: 00:01
English translation:a "nation of scroungers"
Explanation:
Seems to be a term employed by UK press at least,

www.thesun.co.uk/discussions/posts/list/105/1395.page

and gets quite a few google hits.
Selected response from:

Emma Rogers
France
Local time: 06:01
Grading comment
ça a l'air fort comme terme, but I think it is what Nicolas Sarkozy is really meaning...considering what he has said so far in his speeches and the rest of the text that I have : «Il a également annoncé qu'il n'y aurait plus de minimas sociaux sans contrepartie d'activité minimum d'intérêt général»
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +10a country of people on welfare/welfare recipients
Raymonde Gagnier
4 +3the land of welfare recipients / dole takers
Anton Konashenok
3 +4a country/land of spongers
CMJ_Trans (X)
4 +2"nanny state"
Tony M
4 +1turn it round
Bourth (X)
3 +1a nation on benefit
Dylan Edwards
4welfare state
Odette Grille (X)
3 -1a land of government beneficiaries
Carmen Schultz
3 -1a "nation of scroungers"
Emma Rogers


  

Answers


25 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +3
the land of welfare recipients / dole takers


Explanation:
the term "welfare state" comes to mind first, but it has another, much milder connotation - a state with well-developed social services


Anton Konashenok
Czech Republic
Local time: 06:01
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian, Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  cjohnstone: welfare recipients seems fine
2 hrs
agree  Carmen Schultz: that is one way to say it
2 hrs
neutral  writeaway: "the" land means the one and only. the French says "un pays" which is "a country". small change but big difference in meaning.
4 hrs
  -> that was intentional, but now I fail to understand why I chose this :-)
agree  Odette Grille (X): to me it seems neutral enough. As in The land of plenty
6 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

35 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +10
a country of people on welfare/welfare recipients


Explanation:
À ma connaissance il n'y a pas d'équivalent réel, il faut traduire...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 39 mins (2007-01-31 06:23:25 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

La France est déjà un "welfare state" donc il faut chercher ailleurs... J'irais même jusqu'à "a country on welfare".

Raymonde Gagnier
Canada
Local time: 00:01
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  nicole GELISTER: living on benefits ???n
1 hr
  -> Yes!
agree  Sandra Petch: "on welfare", or nicole's suggestion "on benefits". A more negative slant could be "people living on handouts".
2 hrs
  -> Thank you!
agree  jean-jacques alexandre: I think" country on welfare" carries on exactly what Sarko wants to project
2 hrs
  -> Thanks!
agree  Julie Barber: I'm agreeing for you pointing out the difference between 'welfare state' and a country 'on welfare/benefits'
2 hrs
  -> Thank you!
agree  Carmen Schultz: that is one way to say it
2 hrs
  -> Thanks!
agree  Béatrice Huret-Morton: I like "a country on welfare".
4 hrs
  -> So do I! thanks!
agree  Emma Rogers: I also like 'a country on welfare'
4 hrs
  -> Thank you!
agree  Alison Jenner: "on welfare" or as nicole suggested, "on benefits"
4 hrs
  -> Thank you!
agree  Dylan Edwards: I'd go for "on benefit" (UK version), as I've suggested, or "on welfare".
6 hrs
  -> Thanks!
agree  Vicky Papaprodromou
7 hrs
  -> Thank you!
agree  AllegroTrans: I agree with "on benefit"
11 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
a land of government beneficiaries


Explanation:
I just came up with a different twist meaning the same

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2007-01-31 09:05:14 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

A Guide For Representative Payees“Sunnydale patients’ fund for Social Security beneficiaries. ... The beneficiary starts receiving another government benefit, or the amount of the benefit ...
www.ssa.gov/pubs/10076.html - 39k - Cached - Similar pages

Night Light: Neocons in Space: Pre-emptive War Goes Interplanetary... to privatizing goverment-funded space projects, an initiative that could hand billions more tax dollars to the usual set of government beneficiaries. ...
nightlight.typepad.com/nightlight/2006/10/neocons_in_spac.html - 45k - Cached - Similar pages

USGS Water Data ProgramWater-data collection is a necessary role of government. ... ernment Federal Government beneficiaries---State and local Government and State and government ...
water.usgs.gov/wid/html/WD.html - 29k - Cached - Similar pages


Carmen Schultz
Local time: 23:01
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish, Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  AllegroTrans: No, this does not make sense in the context
9 hrs
  -> Perhaps it does not to you, but it does to me in my context and existence !
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +4
a country/land of spongers


Explanation:
off the state

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2007-01-31 09:01:33 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

the land of the free hand-out

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2007-01-31 11:37:16 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

A NATION OF SPONGERS

CMJ_Trans (X)
Local time: 06:01
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 184

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  writeaway: a country of spongers if UK jargon is what is needed. does sound like Sarkozy speak, doesn't it?/yes nation definitely!! in any case, this answer sounds the least "translated"
1 hr
  -> nation is an even better word - just came to me
agree  awilliams
1 hr
agree  Sandra Petch: "Nation" is definitely better than "country" IMO. Is "spongers" more derogatory than "assistés" (a question, not a disagreement!)?
3 hrs
  -> I can assure you that Sarko was not being complimentary! I suspect spongers or scroungers is the "soft" version
neutral  AllegroTrans: It's a loaded word, personally I would stick to a more neutral word expression like "on benefits"
9 hrs
agree  Tony M: I like it with "nation", but do agree that the derogatory connotation would be over-interpreting compared with the actual WORDS (if not the intention!)
9 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

6 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
a "nation of scroungers"


Explanation:
Seems to be a term employed by UK press at least,

www.thesun.co.uk/discussions/posts/list/105/1395.page

and gets quite a few google hits.


    Reference: http://www.adamsmith.org/images/uploads/publications/wwwtws....
    Reference: http://www.parliament.the-stationery-office.co.uk/pa/cm19899...
Emma Rogers
France
Local time: 06:01
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Grading comment
ça a l'air fort comme terme, but I think it is what Nicolas Sarkozy is really meaning...considering what he has said so far in his speeches and the rest of the text that I have : «Il a également annoncé qu'il n'y aurait plus de minimas sociaux sans contrepartie d'activité minimum d'intérêt général»

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Odette Grille (X): this seems extremely derogatory to me
21 mins
neutral  Sandra Petch: "Scroungers" and "spongers" seems too strong to me. Le Petit Robert defines "assisté" simply as "qui reçoit l'assistance".
28 mins
neutral  Sheila Wilson: agree with above comments but I do think that nation is better than country or land
55 mins
neutral  Bourth (X): That's certainly how it could come across, but I'd be wary of putting it so blatantly in Sarko's mouth.
3 hrs
disagree  AllegroTrans: d'accord avec Bourth:It's certainly a valid term, but I think it's too loaded, in context
6 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

7 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
a nation on benefit


Explanation:
They have no overall vision about the need to have a nation at work rather than a nation on benefit, and that is no way to provide real security for the ...
www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm199596/cmhansrd/vo96022...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 7 hrs (2007-01-31 13:04:05 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

This is, of course, a UK version.

Dylan Edwards
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:01
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  AllegroTrans: benfit or benefits - sounds fine to me
5 hrs
  -> Thanks
neutral  nicole GELISTER: benefits (plural in UK ) as there are so many kind of benefits, housing, incapacity, etc..
7 hrs
  -> Thanks. I think the singular is permissible as a collective term. True, there are different kinds.
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

9 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
turn it round


Explanation:
<<I don't want France to become a nanny State".

Be wary of any connotations that might be put on what Sarko says, especially in light of the "Kärcher" business a year ago.

I think the notion of "assistés" is to French what "nanny State" is to English, and by addressing the "nanny State" rather than the "assisté" you avoid or reduce any possibility of people taking offence to being called something they don't like. Il n'y a que la vérité qui blesse.

Bourth (X)
Local time: 06:01
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 73

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Connor: Yes to nanny state
2 hrs
disagree  AllegroTrans: Too loaded! I don't think you can construe this undertone from the original
2 hrs
agree  Tony M: Yes, now that Connor has rawn my attention to your answer, which I missed before (sorry!) I don't think it's too loaded at all...
2 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

10 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
"nanny state"


Explanation:
Although this possibly has slightly wider connotations still, I think it is a more or less equivalent current usage in the UK

Tony M
France
Local time: 06:01
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 56

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Connor: another nanny state (you have to really scroll quite a way down on this one ;-)
1 hr
  -> Thanks, Connor! True, I missed it hidden away there in the body of Alex's answer.
disagree  AllegroTrans: too loaded!
2 hrs
  -> Thanks, Allegro! I think it is very much on a par with the tenor of the original remark. You need to hear it in context... ;-)
agree  Carmen Schultz: I can see this too. I think it works nicely.
4 hrs
  -> Thanks, Carmen! Has the advantage of not being in itself derogatory, but implying all the same "mollycoddling"
agree  Odette Grille (X): cute
5 hrs
  -> Merci, Odette !
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

15 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
welfare state


Explanation:
More common...

Odette Grille (X)
Canada
Local time: 00:01
Works in field
Native speaker of: French
PRO pts in category: 4
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)



Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.

You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs (or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.

Return to KudoZ list

KudoZ™ translation help

The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.

See also:
ProZ.com term search
Search millions of term translations
Close search
Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search