| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Off topic: Customer is SO being taken for a ride! Thread poster: maria pelufo
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maria pelufo 
Uruguay
Local time: 13:08
English to Spanish
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Well, I did not know where to share my agonizing feelings...
I have been translating for a while some "love letters" between a gentleman in a South American country that should remain unnamed, and a lady in an African country that also should remain anonymous.
The letters started with their encounter, obviously through an online site. And then progressed to the point in which she is now professing her undying love, and affection and manifests how ready she is to turn her life... See more Well, I did not know where to share my agonizing feelings...
I have been translating for a while some "love letters" between a gentleman in a South American country that should remain unnamed, and a lady in an African country that also should remain anonymous.
The letters started with their encounter, obviously through an online site. And then progressed to the point in which she is now professing her undying love, and affection and manifests how ready she is to turn her life upside down, and go and move with him...
Very romantic, right?
If it wasn´t because the letters (with a grammar and spelling so atrocious that sometimes I have a hard time understanding what she really means, but that through my work make her almost sound like a scholar to him if it wasn´t for the obvious repetitions, etc. Which, of course, do stay) are less and less about romance, and more and more about Western Union transfers to solve all kinds of problems she is having: she has to go to the clinic, and if she does not pay all in one payment (no installments) she will go to jail, together with her child. The child is sick, but she does not have money to take him to the hospital. The deadline to pay for the hospital is tomorrow, so he has to send all the money today, and no later than 7 PM or she will go to jail. She has to pay for the language courses to go live with him, etc. etc. etc.
I am heartbroken. I can almost feel by her letters how he reacts (I see only one side of the correspondence, of course), and my hands are tied! I cannot send him a note saying: "listen, I can make a phone call to that clinic and arrange something for you, if you want... it is no bother! I would do it for free!!". It would not be ethical!
And I just SUFFER!
I am just sharing here because I have nowhere to go with this. You understand there is nothing to do, of course. I just needed to vent.
As with other love stories I had in the past, this one will take its course... And it will be what it will be. But I really, really feel for this man!
Thanks for listening.
Maria ▲ Collapse
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Maria, this is not a love story! This is a scam and you are helping this criminal, knowing that he/she is conducting fraud.
If I were you, I would inform the victim AND the authorities immediately.
| | | | avsie (X)
Local time: 19:08
English to French
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| You know he's being scammed, right? | Jan 16, 2012 |
You do realise he's being scammed, and that you are actually helping him being scammed?
| | | | Attila Piróth
France
Local time: 19:08
Member
English to Hungarian
+ ...
The second edition of Mona Baker's "In Other Words" contains an extremely thought-provoking chapter on "Beyond equivalence: ethics and morality". It presents quite difficult situations, including an example that is also cited by Angelelli
Let’s say you are a good interpreter, right? And you are interpreting everything that is going on. All of a sudden, I am a nurse, I come in the room and I tell the doctor, “you are giving the patient erythromycin and he is allergic to it. Do you still want to give him that or change it?” Now there is no need for you to interpret that. It has nothing to do with the patient.
Baker comments that the interpreter is clearly not aware of any ethical questions relating to the patient's right to have access to the full interaction in which he or she is not only involved but is also the subject of conversation and decision-making.
In your case, if you have substantiated suspicions that your client would scam the other, keeping silent and performing the task is not an ethical option.
Needless to say, you will lose this client. Chances are, you will lose a client that would not pay anyway: if "she" can scam someone and even ask for assistance from a third party, I don't think "she" will be moved an inch by a bad BB rating or threats of sending a debt-collection agency. But keeping a client that breaks the law should not be a priority for any translator.
Best,
Attila
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Ty Kendall
United Kingdom
Local time: 18:08
Hebrew to English
| You're basically an accomplice to this crime.... | Jan 16, 2012 |
I'm especially concerned with the "I have been translating for a while..."
also...
I am heartbroken. I can almost feel by her letters how he reacts (I see only one side of the correspondence, of course), and my hands are tied! I cannot send him a note saying: "listen, I can make a phone call to that clinic and arrange something for you, if you want... it is no bother! I would do it for free!!". It would not be ethical!
It's also unethical to willingly cooperate (directly or indirectly) in a scam.
Giving you the benefit of the doubt for a moment, that you really weren't sure of the nature of the correspondence until its true nature revealed itself, then it would be unethical of you NOT to disclose what you have learned.
You don't owe "your client" any confidentiality (they are a con-artist for God's sake! - I also doubt your client is a woman but...anyway....)
Two wrongs don't make a right - keeping shtum is the WRONG thing to do. You have the chance to make amends for your (unintentional) part in all this - inform the man involved, inform the relevant authorities.
In addition, if you haven't been paid yet, I wouldn't hold your breath....
| | | | maria pelufo
Uruguay
Local time: 13:08
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | You do not know he is being scammed. | Jan 16, 2012 |
Thank you very much for the feedback, but my information perhaps was not sufficient for you to form an opinion:
If I knew, that this is a scam, it would be a different story.
But:
a) He answered an ad in an e-harmony kind of place.
b) He is willingly exchanging love letters with the lady, he is on her facebook, he is chatting on MSN with her, he is exchanging photos with her, etc. it is not just asking money. He has her address, he has her phon... See more Thank you very much for the feedback, but my information perhaps was not sufficient for you to form an opinion:
If I knew, that this is a scam, it would be a different story.
But:
a) He answered an ad in an e-harmony kind of place.
b) He is willingly exchanging love letters with the lady, he is on her facebook, he is chatting on MSN with her, he is exchanging photos with her, etc. it is not just asking money. He has her address, he has her phone number, he has ways to contact her.
He sends her money personally, not just anonymously. They are planning to move in together. It is more than just an anonymous contact.
c) He is aware of all this, he is willingly participating, it is not just about the money. He is "helping her". I have done this before with people in other countries, and the only difference is that the "help" was less, and there were less dramatic stories. What I suspect is that this woman has a gambling problem or something like that! That is why she needs money urgently.
In many other cases with one partner with more money, the other with less, often they visit, they meet, and then I translate the letters after the meeting and all is fine. It happens ALL THE TIME. And they do send money, but less often, and the demands are less pressing. Haven´t you heard of such cases? Never translated such letters? I do it all the time, perhaps due my language combinations! (German-Spanish: Germans with Cubans, Germans with L.A? or French-Spanish: Africans, and Latin Americans?)
I do not think this is just a plain scam. I think this is a woman that is abusing a man.
And that, has happened since the down of times, and unethical as it may seem, is not a crime.
I read the letters, I know what I am talking about. You haven´t
I just hope, he gets wise, and he takes a plane, and straightens things out with her. I am pretty sure, something is going on...
In the meantime, he is always so happy that I translate quickly, and accurately for him, always so eager to get my letters, and gives me glowing reviews. I really like him! I can see he is a man with a good heart. If he is in love, and he wants to help her, who are we to judge? Eventually, he will either travel and see for himself, or get tired of all this!
But it is not a plain 404 Nigerian scam. Those look very different!
And of course those are immediately to be reported.
I know that.
Thanks for answering.
Maria ▲ Collapse
| | | | maria pelufo
Uruguay
Local time: 13:08
English to Spanish
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TOPIC STARTER | PS: I forgot to mention, I am doing this through an agency.... | Jan 16, 2012 |
So any contact with the customer is forbidden to me in any case!
I wrote to the Agency though.
It is up to them.
I doubt they will do anything.
M.
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 19:08
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
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| Your responsibility | Jan 16, 2012 |
Are you aware that you are responsible here and that you are actually helping out a scammer?
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Juno Bos
Netherlands
Local time: 19:08
Member (2011)
German to Dutch
+ ...
| It's not him, it's "her" | Jan 16, 2012 |
I am afraid you don't get it. It's not he who is the scammer, he is the one being scammed
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 19:08
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
If I notice lies and any sort of cheating in a correspondence I'm translating ( and unfortunately it has happened to me before while translating for direct clients), I will stop the cooperation the same second. I'll just tell them I can't take on their jobs any more since I'm too busy. I certainly won't be wasting any of my time educating them about ethics.
They can range from small lies about why they missed out that deadline, to big lies or those mean poker lies. Whatever they are... See more If I notice lies and any sort of cheating in a correspondence I'm translating ( and unfortunately it has happened to me before while translating for direct clients), I will stop the cooperation the same second. I'll just tell them I can't take on their jobs any more since I'm too busy. I certainly won't be wasting any of my time educating them about ethics.
They can range from small lies about why they missed out that deadline, to big lies or those mean poker lies. Whatever they are, I can spot them easily.
[Edited at 2012-01-16 13:11 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | maria pelufo
Uruguay
Local time: 13:08
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Thanks for your input. | Jan 16, 2012 |
You gave me a lot to think about, and I will stop taking work from the agency for this particular customer for ethical reasons.
I know other translators take it, because I see it on the board, and this accomplishes nothing, but as you say, at least I will not have a bad feeling. And if there was a scam, I will not be an accomplice.
I also reported the case to the Agency with all the details, in writing (I had done that before posting too).
I will know I m... See more You gave me a lot to think about, and I will stop taking work from the agency for this particular customer for ethical reasons.
I know other translators take it, because I see it on the board, and this accomplishes nothing, but as you say, at least I will not have a bad feeling. And if there was a scam, I will not be an accomplice.
I also reported the case to the Agency with all the details, in writing (I had done that before posting too).
I will know I may NOT have been collaborating with a POSSIBLE scam, because unlike you, I am NOT sure this is a scam.
I cannot judge so quickly. I do think there is abuse by asking for so much money, but that is all I know.
I am surprised at how harsh, some answers were, though. I had before the feeling that this is not a kind group, and have that feeling again.
Thanks a lot for taking the time to reply, though.
Maria ▲ Collapse
| | | | Ty Kendall
United Kingdom
Local time: 18:08
Hebrew to English
The fact that you are doing this through an agency is irrelevant. Agencies are hardly the pillars of morality are they, with them the bottom line is usually...money!
So this in no way shifts any reponsibility away from you I'm afraid.
There are a few things you seem oblivious to:
1) This is not a woman writing to a man. It's a man [pretending to be a woman] writing to another man.
2) Any addresses, contact information, social networking etc can... See more The fact that you are doing this through an agency is irrelevant. Agencies are hardly the pillars of morality are they, with them the bottom line is usually...money!
So this in no way shifts any reponsibility away from you I'm afraid.
There are a few things you seem oblivious to:
1) This is not a woman writing to a man. It's a man [pretending to be a woman] writing to another man.
2) Any addresses, contact information, social networking etc can be easily faked. He may have "her" phone number, but I can guarantee "she" has female acquaintances willing to play the part for a slice of the action....
....although one thing I'm not clear on....if they chat on MSN, why do they need a translator to translate other correspondence????
3) You seem blinded by the "love story", despite the fact it's totally fabricated and artificial. Scammers are meant to charm money out of their victims, "they plan to move in together", I'm surprised "she" hasn't proposed to him yet.
You also seem to think we NEED to read the letters to smell a scam here. I'm sorry but when someone from "an African country" - I'm guessing Nigeria (Lagos) writes to you talking about WESTERN UNION begging for cash for a plethora of ridiculous excuses:
and more and more about Western Union transfers to solve all kinds of problems she is having: she has to go to the clinic, and if she does not pay all in one payment (no installments) she will go to jail, together with her child. The child is sick, but she does not have money to take him to the hospital. The deadline to pay for the hospital is tomorrow, so he has to send all the money today, and no later than 7 PM or she will go to jail. She has to pay for the language courses to go live with him, etc. etc. etc.
...Then it doesn't take a genius to spot what's going on and from the tone in your original post (quoted above) it seems you concur....although for some reason you are now changing your tune??? Bizarre.
I find your rather flippant attitude 'it's not so bad because it's a "woman" doing it to a man' disturbing to say the least.
I suggest you read:
http://www.midsummerseve.com/article/online_dating_scams_419
or
http://www.romancescam.com/forum/portal.php
....and ask yourself if any of it sounds familiar.
I just hope, he gets wise
I just hope, he's not the only one to get wise. ▲ Collapse
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Ty Kendall
United Kingdom
Local time: 18:08
Hebrew to English
| Cruel to be kind | Jan 16, 2012 |
I'm sorry if you feel my comments in particular were harsh, but the man involved is not the only one who could get burned by all this.
You yourself are in a vulnerable position by having "this person" as a client (even through an agency).
Discontinuing these translations and reporting the [quite obvious] scam is as much for your benefit as his.
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maria pelufo wrote:
The letters started with their encounter, obviously through an online site. And then progressed to the point in which she is now professing her undying love...
more and more about Western Union transfers to solve all kinds of problems she is having: she has to go to the clinic, and if she does not pay all in one payment (no installments) she will go to jail, together with her child. The child is sick, but she does not have money to take him to the hospital. The deadline to pay for the hospital is tomorrow, so he has to send all the money today, and no later than 7 PM or she will go to jail. She has to pay for the language courses to go live with him, etc. etc. etc.
This is a textbook example of a scam. There is no imaginable universe in which it could possibly be anyhting else. It's a variant of the classic Nigerian scam or "419 scam". This particular version is called the Romance scam.
The scammer may be a man or a woman, and the photos they're sending might even be real. It doesn't matter, it's a scam either way.
If I were you, I would inform the agency, then inform the client (or let the agency take it from there).
[Edited at 2012-01-16 13:59 GMT]
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the man who receives the letters is aware of the lies she is telling him. What if he has enough money and is in love and wants to help her? What if he accepts her lies for some reason?
As Maria Pelufo said: Who are we to judge?
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