| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4] > | Off topic: What would you do now if Proz.com had not existed. Thread poster: Williamson
|
|---|
Boris Rogowski 
Germany
Local time: 18:01
Member (2008)
English to German
Kevin Lossner wrote:
But life's too short for me to waste on such things. If some young upstart wants to step in and grab most of my business by writing better sounding, more accurate translations delivered early every time, I wish s/he would hurry up and do so - I need more time with my novels and my dogs.
Thank you, Kevin. These are wise words, simple as they may sound. The foremost reason translation makes me a happy camper is the substantial amount of freedom it allows me. Unlike most people I know I have enough time for reading, playing music, taking long walks (so the dog is a happy camper, too), making city trips etc. without having to live under a bridge and brewing coffee in tins (though that sounds like fun - sans the bridge part). Competicion? I can't even spell that word...
To make the post on topic: If it wasn't for ProZ I couldn't enjoy those sporadic words of wisdom from my fellow linguists. I'm planning to visit my first Powwow in DüDo to finally get to know some of them
| | | |
Williamson wrote:
I did not say it is "wrong". I said that I find it odd to specialize in a particular field to end up translating.
True, you did. The trouble is, if you say you find something "wrong", there is typically either an express or implied logical or moral (or both) argument behind the statement, which can be discussed, argued, dissected, etc.
If you say you find something "odd", without properly explaining why, anyone who wishes to engage in dialogue with you on the topic has to take a few steps down the road that the word you wanted to use was "wrong", and argue from that position.
It might also be worth noting that there have been a number of threads in the past on the incompetence of some of those coming at translation from a purely academic background. I have myself had to correct a lovely-sounding translation from a very clever lady who had evidently never set foot in a office and had no idea what an annual appraisal was, the purpose it served, etc. Study & qualifications are fine and dandy, but some experience never goes amiss.
Most would not have thought of translation, if it weren't for translation portals.
Pure conjecture at best, unadulterated bilge of the highest order at worst. I'd need to see some figures before I accepted that kind of statement. Since figures are unlikely to be available, I'd like to know how you arrived at "most".
Portals are still relatively recent. Vast numbers of people changed career before portals were even thought of. Some, such as yours truly, changed career after portals came into existence but witout being aware of them. To say that translation portals actually inspire the majority of career changes into translation seems a little.... what's the word I want.... "odd"?
(And quite honestly, if I were considering a career-change now, and I discovered proz, and only proz, I think I'd decide to change to something else )
| | | | | But not for Swedish | Aug 18, 2009 |
Paola Dentifrigi wrote: Madeleine MacRae Klintebo wrote:
I have studied both law, but not to anywhere near degree level, and linguistics, and based on the documentation I supplied, I was invited to tender for freelance translation work. As my work conditions changed at the time, I choose not to tender so I can only guess at how the process would have continued. But at no time during my application was the fact that I do not hold a law degree considered. It is true for some language pairs. I was invited fot PL/RO>IT, and I do not have a degree in law. For the most common pairs you do need a degree in law. I imagine it'd be quite impossible to find a law graduate who knows Polish and is a professional translator. Paola
I've found a specialised agency in Stockholm where all the translators (only working SV-EN or EN-SV) have law degrees, Swedish or from various English speaking countries. On top of that they also have working experience in business and finance, at least those I've worked with. But hey, they're not cheap so are very unlikely to feature on proz.
Editing:
I forgot to mention that this agency doesn't use freelancers, sorry. When I've used them in my in-house position, I've always known who will do the translation (in my case always the same person).
[Edited at 2009-08-18 19:51 GMT]
| | | | | Are you sure about that? | Aug 18, 2009 |
Madeleine MacRae Klintebo wrote:
I've found a specialised agency in Stockholm where all the translators (only working SV-EN or EN-SV) have law degrees, Swedish or from various English speaking countries. On top of that they also have working experience in business and finance, at least those I've worked with. But hey, they're not cheap so are very unlikely to feature on proz.
... not featuring on ProZ, I mean. After all, if it weren't for translation portals, how else would they have even thought of translation in the first place?
And a whole agency of them? How odd. I mean why on earth would they want to move in on the turf of that rare (yet unprotected) species known as 'the real translator'? What must the public think?
I'm totally confused. It beggars belief that this can happen.
[ironic mode switched off]
| | |
|
|
|
Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 18:01
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
| Dilettantism | Aug 18, 2009 |
Unfortunately, I have not seen so many dilettantes in any other profession like I have in translation.
" I love it", " words are my passion", etc...
No comment.
p.s. I am speaking in general, not referring only to the Internet market.
| | | | | No doubt ... | Aug 18, 2009 |
Lingua 5B wrote:
Unfortunately, I have not seen so many dilettantes in any other profession like I have in translation.
... but I willing to bet on it, it won't be among the translators -- sorry lawyers turned translators -- at the agency referred to above.
| | | | | Please sit down Debs | Aug 18, 2009 |
Lawyer-Linguist wrote:
... not featuring on ProZ, I mean. After all, if it weren't for translation portals, how else would they have even thought of translation in the first place?
And a whole agency of them? How odd. I mean why on earth would they want to move in on the turf of that rare (yet unprotected) species known as 'the real translator'? What must the public think?
I'm totally confused. It beggars belief that this can happen.
[ironic mode switched off]
Before I'm dragged in front of a judge to explain how my posting in no way contributed to your heart attack.
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 18:01
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
Madeleine MacRae Klintebo wrote:
Before I'm dragged in front of a judge to explain how my posting in no way contributed to your heart attack.
lol
Discussion boards can be dangerous.
| | |
|
|
|
Madeleine MacRae Klintebo wrote: Lawyer-Linguist wrote:
... not featuring on ProZ, I mean. After all, if it weren't for translation portals, how else would they have even thought of translation in the first place?
And a whole agency of them? How odd. I mean why on earth would they want to move in on the turf of that rare (yet unprotected) species known as 'the real translator'? What must the public think?
I'm totally confused. It beggars belief that this can happen.
[ironic mode switched off]
Before I'm dragged in front of a judge to explain how my posting in no way contributed to your heart attack.
Don't think I'll be the one having it somehow
Nice one
Debs
| | | | | No, it'll be me | Aug 18, 2009 |
Lawyer-Linguist wrote: Don't think I'll be the one having it somehow Nice one Debs
Long story, but it has to do with monolingual lawyers outsourcing work to lawyers rather than lawyer-linguists...
I've given them a few examples (of bad/incorrect translation) today and have got a 1-day extension plus the possibility of more time. The wonders of working in-house.
| | | | Williamson
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:01
Flemish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
@ Kevin: A specialist as a supplier of terminology
Exactly. 10 years ago, an agency came with construction specifications. I do not believe the motto of a translator school : "Armed with dictionaries we attack all kind of texts". So, I worked together with an engineer, specialised in construction. He supplied the terminology and I translated. However, why work together with a lowly linguist?
So, he send his texts directly to the agency, who came back to me with the request to correc... See more @ Kevin: A specialist as a supplier of terminology
Exactly. 10 years ago, an agency came with construction specifications. I do not believe the motto of a translator school : "Armed with dictionaries we attack all kind of texts". So, I worked together with an engineer, specialised in construction. He supplied the terminology and I translated. However, why work together with a lowly linguist?
So, he send his texts directly to the agency, who came back to me with the request to correct the text, full of dialect expressions. However, they also came back to ask for that engineer, because translators armed with dictionaries, did not understand what was in the text.
The system : specialist as supplier of terminology-linguist as translator of the text and review by both works. I've applied it on various occassions and the results have always been positive.
-*-*-
Happy with translation? Well, I do see the advantages of it. The sun is shining, I do not have to stand in a 40 mile long traffic-jam to earn a living, the sheep and horses are in the meadows, I can taste the sound of silence. You can plug your computer in the wall in the most fiscally friendly country on earth. It is a good preparation for a training in conference interpreting (scriptum manent, verbum volant- I'd rather be on the "volant" side), which I have been postponing for years, due to the fact that I take evening classes of master in management.
After all, those who have both: a "useless" translator degree and a specialisation are the one's sought after on the market. These courses have been dragging on for a couple (3) of years and will drag on another year until I get my degree.
Perhaps, the rest of the discussion in Düdorf, if I do not have to study a biz.course or am working on my graduation paper.
[Edited at 2009-08-19 07:33 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | |
Williamson wrote:
The system: specialist as supplier of terminology-linguist as translator of the text and review by both works.
I'm sure it does -- and probably at considerable expense -- when there is no other option, but you must surely agree that the fact this system does/can work does not preclude the fact that some people are skilled enough in both departments to do the job themselves?
| | |
|
|
|
Lawyer-Linguist wrote: Williamson wrote:
The system: specialist as supplier of terminology-linguist as translator of the text and review by both works. I'm sure it does -- and probably at considerable expense -- when there is no other option, but you must surely agree that the fact this system does/can work does not preclude the fact that some people are skilled enough in both departments to do the job themselves?
Hi Debs,
I think there is no doubt that you can have people without any "specialized" degrees and just a "translation" degree who can do a good job in specialized areas, simply because of their experience (and training) in the corresponding specialized subject-matter, just like you can have people with "specialized" degrees who can also do a good job in the linguistic area (because of their training or talent in this area).
Regardless of the "degree" part, it obviously takes both talents, linguistic/specialization, to get a "professional" translation, but you are right that the idea of finding a person who has both probably avoids the need for paying an extra reviewer, but, at least in my experience, such exceptions are not always that easy to find.
In this respect, although I don't agree with other comments from Williamson, I still find his hypothetical questions at least valid, because if you decide to study a specific specialization and then choose to become a translator, instead of being a professional in the corresponding field, it sounds, let's be honest, a bit odd, unless you always also had a "passion" for languages and translation (and btw, I don't see anything wrong with having a "passion" for words, languages, etc.).
Of course I completely understand that there are many valid reasons as well to become a translator even if you studied something else. Life sometimes takes us in different directions than those we had planned, so it is perfectly valid to choose a different road because of whatever circumstances. I think that as long as you do a "professional" job, no biggie, because, again, it is clear that this "profession" allows this by not having any laws or strict requirements that demand "exclusiveness".
I just don't like, either, the clear indirect "lobbying" (or even "bullying") some people make against those who have legitimally chosen to study translation. I think any extremes or irrational generalizations, either way, should be avoided.
Hope you are enjoying your summer,
Ivette
| | | | | To clarify matters | Aug 19, 2009 |
Hi Ivette,
Wish the summer was over to be honest, if you have 'English rose' skin like me, it's not a pretty sight if you dare to spend more than a few minutes in this blazing sun.
Looking forward to a pleasant autumn though and a well-deserved week away from this computer. Hope you've been able to appreciate the sun more than me!
I've made it clear here -- and in correspondence we've enjoyed... See more Hi Ivette,
Wish the summer was over to be honest, if you have 'English rose' skin like me, it's not a pretty sight if you dare to spend more than a few minutes in this blazing sun.
Looking forward to a pleasant autumn though and a well-deserved week away from this computer. Hope you've been able to appreciate the sun more than me!
I've made it clear here -- and in correspondence we've enjoyed in the past -- that I do not knock solid translation/interpreting degrees. The IoLET, whilst a professional qualification at postgraduate level, does squat all to improve one's theoretical knowledge and some solid theory doesn't do anyone any harm.
I'm also the first to admit that being a lawyer/doctor does not necessarily mean that person will make a good legal/medical translator.
However, the use of a protectionist term like 'turf' and then 'odd' in the same context is hardly going to go down well with any specialist or 'lateral entry' translator -- nor is the suggestion that if it weren't for ProZ or sites like it, we wouldn't be around -- and might well explain some of what you perceive to be the 'lobbying/bullying' here. As I read those comments, they are directed against those who think they can translate all and sundry, armed with their translation theory and dictionaries, not those with innate talent, who apply what they've learnt and gained subject knowledge.
It may indeed be 'interesting' that some have chosen to combine their specialist background and linguistic ability to become specialist translators, but 'odd' suggests something is just a little bit 'rotten in the State of Denmark' (Denmark being the turf, of course).
At the end of the day, I agree: as long as you do a professional job, no biggie.
Take care
Debs
[Edited at 2009-08-19 13:16 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Choice of words | Aug 19, 2009 |
Lawyer-Linguist wrote: Wish the summer was over to be honest, if you have 'English rose' skin like me, it's not a pretty sight if you dare to spend more than a few minutes in this blazing sun. Looking forward to a pleasant autumn though and a well-deserved week away from this computer. Hope you've been able to appreciate the sun more than me!
Unlike in Portugal, here in Germany (the beautiful Rheingau area) where I live, when you have, like for the past 3-4 days, super shining sun and warm temperatures, it's really a blessing (at least for me). Plus here in Wiesbaden we've had the wonderful "Weinfest" (meaning enjoying lots of wine) week, so it's been great.
Getting back to our topic (smile), of course we completely agree. And you are also right about this being maybe just a matter of the choice of words we non-native English speakers may have used (I hope my mentioning of the "non-native" part doesn't open this other known can of worms ).
Anyway, have fun away from the PC (I hope to do that sometime in September),
Ivette
| | | | | Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4] > | To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator: You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request » What would you do now if Proz.com had not existed. | Trados Business Manager Lite | Create customer quotes and invoices from within Trados Studio
Trados Business Manager Lite helps to simplify and speed up some of the daily tasks, such as invoicing and reporting, associated with running your freelance translation business.
More info » |
| | Trados Studio 2022 Freelance | The leading translation software used by over 270,000 translators.
Designed with your feedback in mind, Trados Studio 2022 delivers an unrivalled, powerful desktop
and cloud solution, empowering you to work in the most efficient and cost-effective way.
More info » |
|
| | | | X Sign in to your ProZ.com account... | | | | | |
Login to reply/comment 
