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This is an insult
Thread poster: Darmali
Thomas Pfann
Thomas Pfann  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:33
Member (2006)
English to German
+ ...
Look at the whole picture not just numbers Apr 22, 2016

Mirko Mainardi wrote:

In this specific case it would probably be something like 1.5 hours, so $18*3/350=$ .15 per word, which (IMO) wouldn't be bad at all, especially for "generic" or light marketing text...


No, in this case it be something like $18/350 words = $0.05 per word.

However, I usually don't place too much importance on the per-word rate. The important thing is what you get paid for your time. Depending on how much time you end up spending on the job, you might still get a decent hourly pay out a job with a seemingly low per-word rate – and vice versa.


 
Mirko Mainardi
Mirko Mainardi  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 09:33
Member
English to Italian
Hourly rate Apr 22, 2016

Thomas Pfann wrote:

Mirko Mainardi wrote:

In this specific case it would probably be something like 1.5 hours, so $18*3/350=$ .15 per word, which (IMO) wouldn't be bad at all, especially for "generic" or light marketing text...


No, in this case it be something like $18/350 words = $0.05 per word.

However, I usually don't place too much importance on the per-word rate. The important thing is what you get paid for your time. Depending on how much time you end up spending on the job, you might still get a decent hourly pay out a job with a seemingly low per-word rate – and vice versa.


That was exactly what I was saying, but applying it to what Edward wrote, that is to say "I'm sure that despite all complaints there are also plenty of translators here that happily take this on at 18 USD/ 30 min".

I said that, personally, I think it would take me about 1.5 hours (rough estimate taking into account the small size of the project) to do those 350 words, which, at $18 per half hour (as mentioned by Edward), would equate to $ .15 per word. Obviously, that would still be $ 36 per hour at the end of the day, which is not so great, but not so bad either (still IMO).


 
Lingua 5B
Lingua 5B  Identity Verified
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 09:33
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
$18 total from a new client? No way. Apr 22, 2016

I have a minimum charge for new clients that's much higher than this.

I would perhaps take on a small piece like that from a client for which I did 1-2 big jobs before (but not repeatedly, and not if it became their "habit").


 
PAS
PAS  Identity Verified
Local time: 09:33
Polish to English
+ ...
Getting rid of pesky agencies Apr 22, 2016

Danguole Kotryna Kapkanaite wrote:
an insult after receiving their phone calls


In cases like this I say: "I'm sorry, there is no one here by that name. You have the wrong number, please delete it from your database."
If I'm in a particularly morbid mood, I say "That person died a long time ago."


 
Gabriele Demuth
Gabriele Demuth  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:33
English to German
Just received this Apr 22, 2016

I have just received this from an agency asking to quote for a project of 1 word with a word price!

Daten des Auftrags
Wortzahl: 1
Deadline: 22.04.2016 - 17:00
Art des Auftrags: übersetzen
Preiseinheit: Pro Wort
Bemerkung für den Übersetzer:

USE the Action dictionary! Translate in the formal way.



 
Schtroumpf
Schtroumpf
Local time: 09:33
German to French
+ ...
PLEASE, what is a "job offer"? Apr 22, 2016

Sorry but I can't really understand what I read hear. Repeatedly, colleagues discuss what they call "job offers". When I look it up for instance in IATE or Termium, a job offer is clearly considered as a vacancy for employed people.

Everybody here seems to discuss freelance markets, so WHY don't they talk about "inquiries", "contract opportunities" or anything like it?

And WHY should language professionals NOT employ correct wording when it comes to their very own job,
... See more
Sorry but I can't really understand what I read hear. Repeatedly, colleagues discuss what they call "job offers". When I look it up for instance in IATE or Termium, a job offer is clearly considered as a vacancy for employed people.

Everybody here seems to discuss freelance markets, so WHY don't they talk about "inquiries", "contract opportunities" or anything like it?

And WHY should language professionals NOT employ correct wording when it comes to their very own job, knowing that they are supposed to be accurate about terminology in every different field??

The only possible explanation is that many posters consider themselves as subordinated to their customers. This is how it works today, anyhow. Give away your power to "the market" (big companies) if you wish, but in this case, there is little reason to complain about the consequences. This concept of customer and supplier relationship first drove me into nagging doubt about the future of our profession, and now seems to demonstrate that there is no future ahead any more.

So why nobody talks about a nice little revolution in here??
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Sheila Wilson
Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 08:33
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
Nothing wrong with either word for freelancers Apr 22, 2016

Schtroumpf wrote:
Repeatedly, colleagues discuss what they call "job offers". When I look it up for instance in IATE or Termium, a job offer is clearly considered as a vacancy for employed people.

Here's the definition of "job":
1. a paid position of regular employment.
"the scheme could create 200 jobs"
"my job involves a lot of travelling"
2. a task or piece of work, especially one that is paid.
"she wants to be left alone to get on with the job"

The second applies perfectly well to us.

"Offer" too, is possible, although I personally prefer to avoid it (when I think about it):
In business, an offer is a proposal to sell or buy a specific product or service under specific conditions:
a tender offer, an offer to buy company stock from existing stockholders under specific conditions
an offer price, or ask price, the price a seller is willing to accept for a particular good


The only possible explanation is that many posters consider themselves as subordinated to their customers. This is how it works today, anyhow. Give away your power to "the market" (big companies) if you wish, but in this case, there is little reason to complain about the consequences. This concept of customer and supplier relationship first drove me into nagging doubt about the future of our profession, and now seems to demonstrate that there is no future ahead any more.

There's certainly a lot of truth in that. Even if the term "job offer" isn't incorrect, the mindset of many freelance translators certainly is.

But I don't like to get too negative about it. I can see a split appearing between the need for skilled professional translators - who know their worth - and the word-crunching translation industry where vast volumes are processed at breakneck speed by pieceworkers who happen to be able to speak two or more languages. I don't know how much future they'll have before MT becomes "good enough" to take over (in quotes as I don't believe it ever will be good enough to trust, but it may be no worse than over-worked, under-paid humans).


 
Michael Newton
Michael Newton  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 04:33
Japanese to English
+ ...
This is an insult Apr 23, 2016

It's possible that this is indicative of the poster country's attitude toward other Asian countries.
When I am offered a ridiculously low quote, I answer with my own insult:
"Why is it that an agency in the wealthiest, most cosmopolitan city in the world (London, Paris, New York, Singapore, Hong Kong, Tokyo) is unable to pay professional rates for a difficult subject (medical, pharmaceutical) in a difficult language like Japanese? Either you are underfunded or poorly managed. Call me
... See more
It's possible that this is indicative of the poster country's attitude toward other Asian countries.
When I am offered a ridiculously low quote, I answer with my own insult:
"Why is it that an agency in the wealthiest, most cosmopolitan city in the world (London, Paris, New York, Singapore, Hong Kong, Tokyo) is unable to pay professional rates for a difficult subject (medical, pharmaceutical) in a difficult language like Japanese? Either you are underfunded or poorly managed. Call me when you get some money."
or:

"That's really low even for a country where half of the people don't have toilets".

or:
"Well, you know that at that rate, you're going to end up with a translator in Dakka or Ouagadouguo, the quality will be poor and the client will refuse to pay. Are you sure you don't want to pay a professional rate?"

To a client who informs me that:
"As usual there is a budget and a modest quote will attract the most attention".

I respond:
"If you pay peanuts you get monkeys".

Also, the LWA ratings are to be taken with a grain of salt. I even suspect (just a gut feeling) that there are a few agencies that have the technology to hack into the proz.com website and remove unfavorable comments. Just sayin'.
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Darmali
Darmali  Identity Verified
Indonesia
Local time: 15:33
English to Indonesian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thank you Apr 23, 2016

Thank you, Michael, you are absolutely right. Japan is one of the most expensive countries in the world, but life in Jakarta and other regions is not cheap either. For this sort of peanuts you won't even get a monkey; the street performers with monkeys charge a lot more for one performance. BTW, I checked their website and they charge clients JPY 5,000 for the first page and JPY 4,000 for the next pages (English Japanese)

Thanks to all who have commented, I really appreciate it. Ha
... See more
Thank you, Michael, you are absolutely right. Japan is one of the most expensive countries in the world, but life in Jakarta and other regions is not cheap either. For this sort of peanuts you won't even get a monkey; the street performers with monkeys charge a lot more for one performance. BTW, I checked their website and they charge clients JPY 5,000 for the first page and JPY 4,000 for the next pages (English Japanese)

Thanks to all who have commented, I really appreciate it. Have a nice weekend.

Angela
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