| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | Beginner questions from a recent academic Thread poster: T. Mark Humphries
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| Yes, I was really puzzled by Elizabeth's | Jul 3, 2013 |
comment that Trados helped her in Art History translations a lot. I cannot somehow see the advantages of this quite heavy (space-wise) and expensive program. What do you mean by terms management -- don;t you know most of the terms by heart? If you use two screens -- this is what I do, what do you need a CAT tool for at all? I was just looking for a very good CAT tool that would help me work on one screen. I think CAT tools may have some advantages in some fields -- especially with high volume fi... See more comment that Trados helped her in Art History translations a lot. I cannot somehow see the advantages of this quite heavy (space-wise) and expensive program. What do you mean by terms management -- don;t you know most of the terms by heart? If you use two screens -- this is what I do, what do you need a CAT tool for at all? I was just looking for a very good CAT tool that would help me work on one screen. I think CAT tools may have some advantages in some fields -- especially with high volume financial translations perhaps, where they help to organize the text, but other than that the advantages are really minor.
As to academic translation -- it is great of course, however there may not be that much work in the literary field, although it is very rewarding. Academic works in scientific fields should be translated by scientists who specialize in the same field as the work is on. I think bombing agencies with resumes is not such a great idea. You may send your CV of course to some agencies that specialize in the fields you are interested in, and you really like them, ▲ Collapse
| | | | Ty Kendall 
United Kingdom
Local time: 18:49
Hebrew to English
LilianBNekipelo wrote:
What do you mean by terms management
Seriously?
| | | | | Yes, seriously Ty | Jul 3, 2013 |
most very experienced translators who know what they are doing do not need any terms management -- text management, or organization yes, but not terms. How many terms you really don't know in a 3,000 word document? One, two?
I know what terms management is -- I am just not sure why it could be important in literary, or art history translation.
[Edited at 2013-07-03 11:56 GMT]
| | | | XXXphxxx (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 18:49
Portuguese to English
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LilianBNekipelo wrote:
I think CAT tools may have some advantages in some fields -- especially with high volume financial translations perhaps, where they help to organize the text, but other than that the advantages are really minor.
Liliana, can I please ask what you mean by "organising the text" in the context of CAT tools? I've seen you mention this several times (in this and other threads) and I'm curious to know what you mean by it.
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| What I mean is that the source text should be served to the translator in the most palatable way -- | Jul 3, 2013 |
meaning separated into meaningful parts -- not just separate sentences (I know this is possible to achieve with many CAT tools), then it should appear on the screen in a place where it it the most convenient for the translator to look at it while typing the translation, which should also be in a conveniently located window. Then, it should allow for easily going back to certain parts of the text which you want to translate later, or go over later. I don't usually need the suggestions -- they ten... See more meaning separated into meaningful parts -- not just separate sentences (I know this is possible to achieve with many CAT tools), then it should appear on the screen in a place where it it the most convenient for the translator to look at it while typing the translation, which should also be in a conveniently located window. Then, it should allow for easily going back to certain parts of the text which you want to translate later, or go over later. I don't usually need the suggestions -- they tend to confuse me more than they are worth -- in my language pairs at least. Then after I am done with the translation, I would like the text -- the final outcome, to be nicely formatted, with the most beneficial layout for that particular type of text. This might be it. I don't really want too many bright colors on the screen -- that might be the last thing really I can think of right now.
I think the CAT tools which have very rich glossaries and unlimited dictionary access might be very important in such fields as medical, pharmaceutical and technical translation, where there are millions of different terms and new ones are being born everyday. Not MT, but just good glossaries and dictionaries-- yes. Ii think now I understand their importance in certain fields, but they should not be imposed on translators in just any field, what some agencies have a tendency to do, because they were basically created for the translator -- to make their work easier, not harder, and CAT tools cause more trouble than they are worth in some fields -- especially such as more general translation and literary translation.
[Edited at 2013-07-03 13:23 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member for the following reason: Empty post | S E (X)
Italy
Local time: 19:49
Italian to English
| terminology management and academic translation | Jul 3, 2013 |
Hi Lilian,
To speak directly to your question, terminology management in academic translation is of course not about compensating for "not knowing words". One of its primary uses is for maintaining consistency and uniformity. Using Trados for academic art history texts provides a function in part similar to what an editor does, making sure that terminology is uniform across a large and complex project.
Where terminology management in academic translation is not about ma... See more Hi Lilian,
To speak directly to your question, terminology management in academic translation is of course not about compensating for "not knowing words". One of its primary uses is for maintaining consistency and uniformity. Using Trados for academic art history texts provides a function in part similar to what an editor does, making sure that terminology is uniform across a large and complex project.
Where terminology management in academic translation is not about maintaining consistency and uniformity, it is about keeping a record of the research one has done on obscure, specialist terms, for future reference and to share with clients and colleagues.
The project I am working on now is of around 90,000 words and there are around 20 separate main texts, all by different authors, all on different aspects of the same highly specific, narrow subject, which happens to be a fourteenth-century fresco cycle: the terminology needs to be uniform between them and this is where the glossary and concordance functions come in. Later, the files with captions will be sent, separately from the 20 main files, and of course there needs to be uniformity between the captions and the main texts as well, something that the glossary and concordance functions again facilitate beautifully. Studio allows maintenance of terminology consistency throughout translations so that that part of the editor's job is already done. Where the editor will take care of ensuring uniformity in the source texts, the translator will ensure it in the target texts.
When I do a smaller translation in Trados, it is usually part of a larger, long-term project for a single end client and again, using Trados for such projects is about terminology management and consistency as well as keeping track of terminology research.
I hope that clears things up for you.
[Edited at 2013-07-03 14:37 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Going to start with another question... | Jul 3, 2013 |
...in case people happening by aren't invested in the prior conversation.
Rates. I had a look at the community rates page and learned that the average rates for FR -> EN translation are 12 cents a word, and (or?) $37.53 an hour. When you bid on a job here, or when you offer your services to companies and agencies, is t... See more ...in case people happening by aren't invested in the prior conversation.
Rates. I had a look at the community rates page and learned that the average rates for FR -> EN translation are 12 cents a word, and (or?) $37.53 an hour. When you bid on a job here, or when you offer your services to companies and agencies, is this more or less what you propose? To what extent should those rates shift relative to the size and complexity of the project? Are the hourly rates more appropriate for proofreading than translation?
As for the CAT tools, I went with WordFast pro for now, as there was a very tasty time-sensitive deal on this site that comes with a training credit. Yes, I would have liked Trados, as it does seem to come closer than any to being the "standard", but the system requirements and the compatibility issues would have required me to purchase another computer either way...which I'm not ruling out in the medium term, but I'd like to find my feet before I shell out that kind of cash.
academic translation
"Academic" covers all manner of sins, and there are only a handful for which I'd be qualified, mostly in the humanities and the social sciences. It's very definitely something at which I'd be good, but unless you're an administrator at NYU, there's not much money to be had in academia. I worked for a bilingual literary journal while doing my PhD course work, and when translations had to be done, they were generally done for free by the editors and assistant editors. Academics aren't paid anything beyond their own salaries to publish, so there's no budget for translation, and I certainly wouldn't have been able to afford to hire myself to translate my 300-page dissertation.
I'm not opposed to looking into it, mind, but my experience with academia (at least the disciplines with which I'm comfortable) doesn't leave me very optimistic when it comes to translation opportunities. The humanities are dying; one of the indicators of this was the fact that when applying for tenure track jobs all across the country, I was competing with between two and five hundred other candidates. During that very demoralizing process, I would routinely whisper a line from Donnie Brasco under my breath:
"Who can get a f****** thing goin' in this f****** city? It's five thousand wiseguys all chasing the same f****** nickel.
And again, I'd just like to thank everyone both in this thread and in my pm's for your warm and generous welcome. This isn't the Oscars, so I don't want to clutter up the thread by thanking everyone individually, but precisely everyone has been helpful.
[Edited at 2013-07-03 13:19 GMT]
[Edited at 2013-07-03 13:36 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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| need for terminology management | Jul 3, 2013 |
LilianBNekipelo wrote:
most very experienced translators who know what they are doing do not need any terms management -- text management, or organization yes, but not terms. How many terms you really don't know in a 3,000 word document? One, two?
Certainly more than one or two, if the text is specialised. Also, there are client glossaries or terms that are translated as A in 99 cases out of 100 and as B in the 100th.
For me, terminology management is absolutely essential.
| | | | | Yes, that might be true about medical and technical translation | Jul 3, 2013 |
It does not really hold true as far as the types of translation I do are concerned. If there were more than 10 terms in a 10 page document that I did not understand at all, I would feel that I would not be really qualified to translate the document.
As to rates, whatever you decide to charge never go beyond a certain minimum rate that you consider fair for yourself, because otherwise the clients and agencies will take advantage of you. If you lower your rates too much, you will los... See more It does not really hold true as far as the types of translation I do are concerned. If there were more than 10 terms in a 10 page document that I did not understand at all, I would feel that I would not be really qualified to translate the document.
As to rates, whatever you decide to charge never go beyond a certain minimum rate that you consider fair for yourself, because otherwise the clients and agencies will take advantage of you. If you lower your rates too much, you will lose any credibility as a good translator.
[Edited at 2013-07-03 14:10 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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LilianBNekipelo wrote:
As to rates, whatever you decide to charge never go beyond a certain minimum rate that you consider fair for yourself, because otherwise the clients and agencies will take advantage of you. If you lower your rates too much, you will lose any credibility as a good translator.
[Edited at 2013-07-03 14:10 GMT]
This can't be stated enough.
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Rates. I had a look at the community rates page and learned that the average rates for FR -> EN translation are 12 cents a word, and (or?) $37.53 an hour.
That's pretty much the same for all pairs, yeah.
When you bid on a job here, or when you offer your services to companies and agencies, is this more or less what you propose?
In my case, the same, other than local Polish agencies.
To what extent should those rates shift relative to the size and complexity of the project?
I wouldn't expect much fluctuation relative to the complexity of the project, but the size should normally result in rush fees if the deadline is tight, while these days clients expect a stock discount like in any other commoditised market.
Are the hourly rates more appropriate for proofreading than translation?
That they are. However, proofreading is usually billed by the word anyway. Hourly rates are like fall-back rates for when you don't know how to extract a word count or character count.
As for the CAT tools, I went with WordFast pro for now, as there was a very tasty time-sensitive deal on this site that comes with a training credit.
Sweet WordFast, fond memories. Trados is better, but Wordfast has a place in my heart where nothing else dwells, as Darth Traya would say. Well, not really, but there's still a tear in my eye.
Yes, I would have liked Trados, as it does seem to come closer than any to being the "standard", but the system requirements and the compatibility issues would have required me to purchase another computer either way...which I'm not ruling out in the medium term, but I'd like to find my feet before I shell out that kind of cash.
Well, I got my 50% student discount for being enrolled in a Ph.D. programme at law school, so you might as well try and claim one next time you sign up for a post-doc.
(...) and I certainly wouldn't have been able to afford to hire myself to translate my 300-page dissertation.
Thing is, you control the supply in that case. The beauty of being your own best, most pampered, premium client. (For example when you translate your copy into French unless you actually write it from scratch.)
"Who can get a f****** thing goin' in this f****** city? It's five thousand wiseguys all chasing the same f****** nickel.
You already know a lot about the translation business, it seems.
***
Actually, may I suggest something? You might want to look at the Golden Circle and the Blue Ocean, to spare yourself some headache. This connects to a couple of things both you and I have mentioned. Actually, there's a good presentation about this available on the Web that was given a couple of weeks ago by a fellow translator and business trainer at a Spanish translation conference. Her friend covered branding. Just be warned, as a fellow cormudgeon I found it really hard to be positive like that. To come up with a good story may be more difficult than it seems, but I'm sure you have what it takes to pull it off superbly, eventually.
[Edited at 2013-07-04 01:35 GMT]
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| Questions and an update... | Jul 31, 2013 |
Thanks everybody, and especially you Lukasz, for all the help.
Just a quick update: I took a Wordfast webinar that was enormously helpful, and I did one translation as a test run to see how it would work out. It turns out that it wasn't terribly useful for that particular translation (a short story for an academic journal, but more on that in a minute), but I really got a feel for it, how it works, and how it will be useful in the future.
That job reinforced my opinio... See more Thanks everybody, and especially you Lukasz, for all the help.
Just a quick update: I took a Wordfast webinar that was enormously helpful, and I did one translation as a test run to see how it would work out. It turns out that it wasn't terribly useful for that particular translation (a short story for an academic journal, but more on that in a minute), but I really got a feel for it, how it works, and how it will be useful in the future.
That job reinforced my opinions about academic translations, as it happens. It was for a journal run by former professors/friends of mine, and the contributor was a French author. Outside of their regular university salaries, precisely no one is paid for producing the issue--not the contributor, not the editors, and certainly not the translator (this was a favor for an old friend who's been very good to me in the past, and the task was well-timed to allow me to test drive my new CAT toy). Had I not done it, one of the editors would have, also for free. There's just no money in academia.
Questions
I still have to do some work on my profile, and only today I happened across "KuDoz points", so I'll be getting into that. But I think the time is coming for me to stop asking questions and just dive in, so these will be of a more practical nature:
Do you all use the invoice feature at ProZ, or do you have your own? How do you calculate tax? How are you paid? Is it best to set up a dedicated Paypal account?
And lastly, a few days ago I received an e-mail from a foreign company with a job offer, asking for rates and thus-and-such. (I'd rather not say which country, as it's not germane to the question and I don't want to offend anyone.) Having done freelance writing for a mobile app consultancy, I know how hard it can be to seek redress for grievances from foreign contractors...how worried will I need to be about not getting paid for work I've done? ▲ Collapse
| | | | Andrea Riffo
Chile
Local time: 13:49
English to Spanish
+ ...
T. Mark Humphries wrote:
Do you all use the invoice feature at ProZ, or do you have your own? How do you calculate tax? How are you paid? Is it best to set up a dedicated Paypal account?
I don't, nor do I plan to, use Proz's invoice feature. Call me paranoid, but I regard both my work and my client list as confidential, so the idea of feeding such sensitive information (clients, projects, monthly income, etc.) to Proz (or any other server, other than my local tax authority) leaves a bad taste in my mouth.**
This is just my own personal opinion, though, and there seem to be some colleagues who use Proz's system regularly and are happy to do so. It's for you to decide.
I use my own manual system with an excel template, which worked perfectly for the first 5 years or so. In the past couple of years, though, my client base (and amount of work) has grown to the point where this system is becoming increasingly time-consuming and I am now starting to consider an investment in proper invoicing software (such as TO3000; search for it in the forums).
Regarding payment, I use Paypal 90% of the time since most of my clients are based in the US and Europe (I'm in Chile), but if you're in the US I assume bank transfer would work fine for you.
(Can't help you on the tax issue, since we have different systems)
T. Mark Humphries wrote:
And lastly, a few days ago I received an e-mail from a foreign company with a job offer, asking for rates and thus-and-such. (. . .) How worried will I need to be about not getting paid for work I've done?
There's always a risk, obviously, but there are ways to minimize it. One of them is checking the Blue Board here or a highly popular (paid) subscription list dedicated exclusively to translation payment practices (not sure if I can name the site here, but google it with those key words ) before committing to a job. Preferably both, though no means is foolproof.
Hope this helps some!
Greetings,
Andrea
PS: ** Before Proz staff jumps on this, this is not meant as a dig at this site. I refrain from using cloud-based/online apps in general, period.
[Edited at 2013-07-31 17:15 GMT]
| | | | Phil Hand
China
Local time: 01:49
Chinese to English
T. Mark Humphries wrote:
There's just no money in academia.
There's a bit. I've been paid for translations of fairly long papers - 20k & 40k words. But no, a lot of academic work gets done by academics themselves on salaries/grants, so it isn't paid for like other translations.
Having done freelance writing for a mobile app consultancy, I know how hard it can be to seek redress for grievances from foreign contractors...how worried will I need to be about not getting paid for work I've done?
It's not common. Ours is a highly trustworthy industry. It has to be, because there is zero chance of redress with a foreign client. Oh, of course it *can* be done. If you have the time and energy to spend 700 dollars on a plane ticket, figure out the various court systems in their jurisdiction, successfully submit and argue your case, and finally receive your 1000 dollar payment.
For small jobs, you just have to develop a good sense for who's a serious player and who's a scammer. Failure to pay by proper agencies/clients is almost unheard of (there are always exceptions), so if you can dodge the scammers, you're mostly safe.
| | | | | Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator: You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request » Beginner questions from a recent academic | Trados Business Manager Lite | Create customer quotes and invoices from within Trados Studio
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