Sick of tags. Which CAT is easiest with tags & works with Mac?
Thread poster: Derek Silva

Derek Silva  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 18:16
Finnish to English
+ ...
Oct 5

Hello, apologies in advance for the newbie question. I have been translating for many years without a CAT tool for my prior employer (a bank) and now, having worked with a translation agency for a year, have also used Memsource (which was pretty good).

Recently, I started with another provider who uses memoQ and my first few experiences were nightmarish, dealing with all of the tags.

They want to hold on to me and asked me, "which CAT tool would you prefer?"
... See more
Hello, apologies in advance for the newbie question. I have been translating for many years without a CAT tool for my prior employer (a bank) and now, having worked with a translation agency for a year, have also used Memsource (which was pretty good).

Recently, I started with another provider who uses memoQ and my first few experiences were nightmarish, dealing with all of the tags.

They want to hold on to me and asked me, "which CAT tool would you prefer?"

Is there a CAT which:
- works directly on Mac (without needing VMware to simulate Windows)
- makes it easy to work with tags (or don't even need to touch them, is that even possible?)
- allows you to still deliver the final product, even if a few tags are unresolved

Not sure if such a tool exists, but no harm in asking!

Having checked through some threads here, it seems that at least these ones work on Mac also?
- Wordfast
- OmegaT
- Cafetran
- Pairaphrase

Thank you
Collapse


 

Hans Lenting  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Member (2006)
German to Dutch
Have a look at CafeTran Oct 5

it is great with tags.

 

Christel Zipfel  Identity Verified
Member (2004)
Italian to German
+ ...
Try Wordfast Classic Oct 5

If you are sick with copying tags and so on (like me), WFC is perfect, and it runs also on Mac. Copied from their website: WFC can run on Windows, Mac and Linux with MS Word running (excluding Mac Word 2008).
As you work within MS Word, you don't have to handle with tags, and no bad surprise either when the translation is completed, of course! I love WFC for that, even if it could be a bit cheaper for what it offers.


 

Wolfgang Schoene  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 12:16
Member
English to German
+ ...
Sick of tags. Oct 5

Christel Zipfel wrote:

If you are sick with copying tags and so on (like me), WFC is perfect, and it runs also on Mac. Copied from their website: WFC can run on Windows, Mac and Linux with MS Word running (excluding Mac Word 2008).
As you work within MS Word, you don't have to handle with tags, and no bad surprise either when the translation is completed, of course! I love WFC for that, even if it could be a bit cheaper for what it offers.


Hi
first you may want to clean your (Word) document with CodeZapper (Windows required) to strip it of all useless and invisible crap. Wordfast 5 Pro for Mac isn't too bad tag-wise. Or, as Hans suggested, use Cafetran, but be prepared for a steep learning curve.


Dan Lucas
 

Derek Silva  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 18:16
Finnish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks everybody Oct 6

Thanks for the replies. I will take a closer look at these CAT tools.

I appreciate it!


 

Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 12:16
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
@Derek Oct 6

Derek Silva wrote:
Recently, I started with another provider who uses MemoQ and my first few experiences were nightmarish, dealing with all of the tags.


While it's true that some CAT tools give too many tags (and some give too few, e.g. Wordfast Pro 3), the number of tags is also affected by the source document. This is why some people here recommend utilities like CodeZapper, which "cleans" up unnecessary tags from e.g. Word files, so that they result in fewer tags when converted to a CAT format.

[It would be interesting to see a comparison between various CAT tools in which the same source files are opened in all of them, to see which of them produce more tags.]

So, it may simply be that the types of files that you have received so far were tag rich, and that other files opened in the same tool (MemoQ) would produce fewer tags. I often translate RTF tables that were converted from MemoQ XLIFF files, and I don't think those files have too many tags.

Is there a CAT which:
- makes it easy to work with tags (or don't even need to touch them, is that even possible?)
- allows you to still deliver the final product, even if a few tags are unresolved


Well, inserting tags in Wordfast Pro 3 and 5 relatively simple, and inserting tags in OmegaT isn't hard either; all three of them (WFP3, WFP5 and OmegaT) allow you to deliver files with tag errors. You can open MemoQ's XLIFF files in all three these tools, although OmegaT's support for it is rather basic and requires tweaking (you need to install a plugin and make sure you select the file type correctly).

It's entirely possible that opening a MemoQ XLIFF file in e.g. WFP5 will result in the same number of tags, but if inserting tags is quicker, then it may be useful for you. In both OmegaT and Wordfast Pro 5, the next tag is either automatically selected or becomes the top available option after you've inserted a tag, which is useful if you insert tags in the same order in the translation as they are in the source text.

In OmegaT, once you've inserted a tag, it no longer appears on the list of tags that you can insert, so in segments with a lot of tags, the list gets shorter each time you insert a tag. The shortcut in OmegaT is Ctrl+spacebar, but then you have to use the arrow keys to select the tag, so unless you select the tag at the top of the list, you need to move your hands in a way that would normally require you to look down at the keyboard.

In all versions of Wordfast, you have to select the tag using Ctrl+Alt+left/right before you can insert the tag using Ctrl+Alt+down, but some versions of Wordfast (e.g. WFP5) the next tag is automatically selected.

(WFA is free but it doesn't automatically select the next tag when you've inserted a tag. Wordfast's web site says that WFP5's unpaid version is 30 days non-demo and thereafter it's limited to TMs of 500 TUs.)


Dan Lucas
 

Derek Silva  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 18:16
Finnish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks! Oct 6

Samuel Murray wrote:

[It would be interesting to see a comparison between various CAT tools in which the same source files are opened in all of them, to see which of them produce more tags.]

So, it may simply be that the types of files that you have received so far were tag rich, and that other files opened in the same tool (MemoQ) would produce fewer tags. I often translate RTF tables that were converted from MemoQ XLIFF files, and I don't think those files have too many tags.



Indeed, this would be interesting. Since I am a newb to the world of CATs, I was wondering if this type of comparison had already been done or not.

Thanks for the tips, Samuel!


 

Jean Dimitriadis  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 12:16
Member
English to French
+ ...
Additional comments Oct 6

Here are some additional comments/suggestions:

OmegaT has a Remove tags option, which strips ALL tags from the imported document(s), but also all formatting, so it's probably not an option. The latest versions, however, also include the TagWipe utility/Groovy script for clearing excessive tags on Word documents. TagWipe offers a GUI that lets the user select different options with which it should be run.

CafeTran Espresso offers a special file filter cal
... See more
Here are some additional comments/suggestions:

OmegaT has a Remove tags option, which strips ALL tags from the imported document(s), but also all formatting, so it's probably not an option. The latest versions, however, also include the TagWipe utility/Groovy script for clearing excessive tags on Word documents. TagWipe offers a GUI that lets the user select different options with which it should be run.

CafeTran Espresso offers a special file filter called "Ms Word OCR" which clears the source text of unnecessary formatting tags. See also Handling Tag Soup - https://cafetran.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/articles/6000160720-handling-tag-soup

CafeTran allows you to display fewer tags than some other tools, with options like Hide segment boundary tags (especially useful when working with external projects, which add tags at the beginning and at the end of each segment) and Merge adjacent tags (which are then treated as one tag).

By default, tags appear as red subscript numbers in CafeTran, which makes them unobstructive.

Inserting tags in the target segment is also very easy and can be done in a number of ways:

- Simply type the tag number + Esc key
- Mouse tag placement = When enabled, tags can be added to the target segment simply by left-clicking where you’d like to place a tag. If you select a word or a word string before activating this, the word or word string is enclosed by two tags.
- List and insert tags via the F3 shortcut
- Insert next tag (keyboard shortcut)
- Insert source, which includes tags

CafeTran also sports a feature called auto-tagger, which may help automatically transfer surrounding tags under some circumstances: https://cafetran.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/articles/6000161178-auto-tagger-transfer-formatting-tags-to-matches

MateCat, a free online CAT tool, has introduced an automatic tag placement feature called "Guess tag position" for some language pairs, including yours. https://www.matecat.com/support/translating-projects/guess-tag-position/

If you consider trying MateCat, here's a warning, however: By default, MateCat stores your translated segments in the public MyMemory TM. To make sure this does not happen unwillingly, create a private TM resource: In the Project creation page, click on Settings (Alternatively, in the TM and glossary field, expand the drop-down menu and select Create resource). Click on + New resource button in the open dialog. Give the TM an optional name. Hit Confirm. You will see that “MyMemory: Collaborative translation memory” resource is Enabled for Lookup, but not set to be Updated anymore. That way, translated segments will only be stored in your private resources.

[Edited at 2019-10-06 17:58 GMT]
Collapse


Hans Lenting
Derek Silva
 

Derek Silva  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 18:16
Finnish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Merci beaucoup! Oct 7

Jean Dimitriadis wrote:

Here are some additional comments/suggestions:



Much appreciated Jean, thank you!


 

Hans Lenting  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Member (2006)
German to Dutch
My favourite way to add tags Oct 8

Jean Dimitriadis wrote:

Inserting tags in the target segment is also very easy and can be done in a number of ways:

- Simply type the tag number + Esc key
- Mouse tag placement = When enabled, tags can be added to the target segment simply by left-clicking where you’d like to place a tag. If you select a word or a word string before activating this, the word or word string is enclosed by two tags.
- List and insert tags via the F3 shortcut
- Insert next tag (keyboard shortcut)
- Insert source, which includes tags


My favourite way to add tags:

  • Press the CMD key, press the left mouse button and drag the mouse pointer over the text to surround with tags.


 


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Sick of tags. Which CAT is easiest with tags & works with Mac?

Advanced search







WordFinder Unlimited
For clarity and excellence

WordFinder is the leading dictionary service that gives you the words you want anywhere, anytime. Access 260+ dictionaries from the world's leading dictionary publishers in virtually any device. Find the right word anywhere, anytime - online or offline.

More info »
SDL Trados Studio 2019 Freelance
The leading translation software used by over 250,000 translators.

SDL Trados Studio 2019 has evolved to bring translators a brand new experience. Designed with user experience at its core, Studio 2019 transforms how new users get up and running and helps experienced users make the most of the powerful features.

More info »



Forums
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search